The Mexican Non-War Begins

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Nova, Oct 29, 2018.

  1. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    It's the power of the mob, it's how populist politics works and it illustrates exactly what underlies the comparisons between Trump and Hitler. It's not just that he's an easy go to bogey man, but the fundamental processes by which both gained popularity are essentially the same, they both played on an existing reservoir of extremist, nationalist views and used them as a platform to power whilst inspiring violence along the way. Fear of the outsider is a powerful motivator to the ignorant.

    The comparison is actually a much more sober and cautious comparison than many are giving credit for and sadly isn't actually hyperbolic when you consider the reasons.
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  2. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    and yet they had to do that chore in body armor and helmet as if they might be taking fire in order to make the best possible propaganda pics.
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  3. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    2016: "Trump says what he thinks! People love that he talks the plain truth! We'll make America great again!"
    2018: "No one cares what the President says."

    Goddamn convenient, says I.
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  4. Man Afraid of his Shoes

    Man Afraid of his Shoes كافر

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    "Take what Trump says seriously...not literally."

    :wtf:

    What does that even mean??!? :bang:
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  5. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    It means take it however he wants you to take it, except for the things he says that he doesn't want you to take at face value. He'll let you know when he's right, which is all of the time, unless it's a joke, and he'll tell you afterward whether it was a joke or not. Don't worry, just do as he says unless he says not to, but do it anyway, in case later he says to do it, unless it's bad, and then he told you not to do it.

    Simple!
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  6. Elwood

    Elwood I know what I'm about, son.

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    Exactly. It’s also how I’m seeing the vote tomorrow framed on social media. This is being framed as a war, a real war, between the good old red, white, and blue and socialist democrats that are one step removed from Joe Stalin.

    It’s bewildering.
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  7. Forbin

    Forbin Do you feel fluffy, punk?

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    Pretty sure that's just the uniform they're required to show up in when on duty.
  8. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    Doesn't that suggest a problem in the policy which makes that stipulation? Shouldn't there be a little more room for expedient flexibility?
  9. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    if they are eligible, joining the military where they get paid to defend our country! If they can't do that, work hard and keep paying those taxes to pay the military. The last option would be chill the fuck out and focus on taking care of their families while the pros take care of the entire country. Everybody wins!
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  10. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    You do realise you've just made a completely left wing post?
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  11. Man Afraid of his Shoes

    Man Afraid of his Shoes كافر

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    But this is what they've been training for the second Saturday afternoon of each month (except for in December which is pot luck) of their entire post pubescent lives!
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  12. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    okay about the picture of the soldiers laying out concertina wire: they are wearing the standard uniform when "downrange" or training for downrange conditions. Kevlar AKA helmet, canteen, body armor, maybe protective mask AKA gas mask. It's called "train as you fight" meaning you wear the uniform that you will be fighting in so you get used to wearing it and moving in it. Sometimes you have to put up fencing while in actual combat areas where you may have to engage the enemy with no notice - thus you wear the uniform for performing all the peripheral tasks as well as combat. You have to know how your body can handle working hard while dealing with the added weight, restriction of movement, lack of circulation and the heat (if applicable). Equipment is a little different but in 2003 the body armor (AKA flak vest) added about 15 degrees to your already heat fatigued body. The helmet trapped in even more heat. Toting weapons & ammo around was a real treat too.

    And it's just not practical to take a lot of different types of clothing downrange. Thus in Iraq for example we had PT (exercise) clothing and our normal tactical camo pants & shirts of course, like in that picture. No civilian clothes - it's actually against the Geneva convention to wear civilian clothes in actual by-god combat unless you have special authorization. Hope that clears things up!
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  13. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    But they aren't in combat, the Pentagon has made that absolutely clear, nor are they training for anything.
  14. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    it's not "left wing" it's basic common sense. Most conservatives are a lot more level headed than the left wing echo chamber gives them credit for. And most of us actual professional military types know we are "the real deal" and don't value the "wanna be" types too much. They talk a good game but unless they've actually successfully served at least one four+ year contract worth of service (unless they got injured of course) we don't pay them much attention.

    And lord have mercy do not bring a "stolen valor" shit-bag around my son! :nono: He will bust one of them out in a very loud & public manner right there in front of god & everybody! :yes:
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  15. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    Alternatively you might just be implicitly saying that there's common sense on the left....:)
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  16. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    There is something we agree upon. "Stolen valor" pisses me off. There are men and women who have fought, and have been wounded in combat, and they don't need some asshole stealing their good name to take advantage of others in order to enrich themselves.
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  17. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    :facepalm: you don't have to be in actual combat to train on the many tasks involved in combat. Everything is a training opportunity! The more realistic the training is the better you will perform. There's a saying - "the more sweat in peacetime, the less blood in combat." :yes: You can't wait until actual combat to wear combat gear - or shoot your weapon - or go without sleep or food - or set up your equipment - you have to know how you will perform under these conditions.
  18. spot261

    spot261 I don't want the game to end

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    I get that, but there are times and places. This is a real deployment with real consequences, both on the ground and political. Wearing body armour does seem to project a very specific image which is provocative and suggests the policy could do with some room for discretion.
  19. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Back atcha.

    It's almost like we should all form a centrist party or somesuch shit.
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  20. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    I fucking wish! But at least on this side of the pond that two party polarizing patronizing behemoth of a system will never ever ever go away.
  21. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    okay spot I'll try it again - the army (the branch I know the best) gets missions. Missions that are made up of tasks and sub-tasks from many different MOS (Military Occupational Specialty) with differing skill sets. They have been training in these various skill sets as a unit and individually for countless hours/days/weeks/months/years in many cases. They cannot alter their tactics or uniforms to appease any political or public relations purposes. They don't care what the general public thinks about them or how they appear to various groups of civilians. They have jobs to do and money to make. The soldiers for the most part don't want to know everyone's opinions, and they aren't interested in giving theirs. Everyone can just stay out of their way and let them earn their money and try to stay safe. Rinse & repeat and next thing you know you did your time - and barring serious injury - you can retire and make the really big money depending on your skill set. I recommend it to every young person who inquires about the profession.
  22. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    also just thought of this spot - how is body armor provocative? :unsure: It's purely defensive. You can't harm somebody with body armor unless you take it off and smother them with it I guess.
    Personally I hate wearing it and I had the lighter version without the ceramic plates. I took mine off every chance I got. On the plus side they are good for wearing when you exercise when running (especially hills) or doing pull ups & push ups for extra resistance. You can also use a gas mask for cardio exercise to build up red blood cells from using less oxygen, but the scientic verdict is still out on that.
  23. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Logically, yeah. Emotionally, if some guy shows up in your yard in plating that negates any form of attack you might have? Well, MAYBE he's just posing for a catalogue. If he isn't, OTOH... do you feel worried?

    Now wonder how you feel if you are engaged in peaceful, but controversial, activity and the "peacekeepers" show up ready to take an RPG to the chest. Do you think they came expecting to chat to you over tea and biscuits?
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  24. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    I'm going to go out on a limb here and say nearly everyone in the caravan has seen people wearing body armor or something like it considering from where they are escaping. :lol:
    Hell many americans wouldn't be too freaked out if they saw people in body armor especially in certain cities. Cops wear it now & again depending on the situation. I think you guys on the other side of the pond lead a sheltered life! ;)
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  25. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    You see guys in body armour on a routine basis and you think MY existence is "sheltered"? :P
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  26. garamet

    garamet "The whole world is watching."

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  27. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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  28. El Chup

    El Chup Fuck Trump Deceased Member Git

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    A wall which won't stop overstayers or people who enter from places other than the border (to say nothing of the inevitably huge staffing costs).
  29. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

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    It wouldn't surprise me if the cost is so high due to the terrain.

    It's a lot harder to build a fence like that along a river than it would be to do it in the desert of Arizona or Southern California. :jayzus:
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  30. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    This just seems like such a stupid, wasteful project.
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