We're all on the same page about Paladin, right?

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by 14thDoctor, Aug 9, 2021.

  1. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    So E.
    :diacanu:
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  2. Tuckerfan

    Tuckerfan BMF

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    You know, like a gun.
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  3. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    The great latest development is doubling down on racism, saying it's not racism but science.
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  4. Tererune

    Tererune Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    I have to agree that is a pretty good term and way to put it. I remember hearing libertarian from a bunch of my good friends. It seems the pre-trump "good" republicans became recovering libertarians and I am so sad that there were so few. If the present republican party is not vominous to you then you are at odds with me.


    Then that starts boiling down to respecting boundaries and there has to be the polite mask over our faces. If you do not want to put that polite mask on then you are going to have consequences.

    In @Paladin 's general defense he can stay the fuck out of other people's business and should not be allowed to be in a position to hire or judge anyone, but in the general public square it is a polite smile and greeting from me. You do not have to like me, have me in your home, chose to watch me on media while I do the things you don't like, and even have media that you like that might verbally insult me. You do not get to push that insulting media on me, but it can be out there.

    I am fine with emasculated racism. I also do not speak for members of any community. If other people are not fine with it then I act accordingly.
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  5. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    It's racist to say there are cultural and biological differences between racial groups?
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  6. MikeH92467

    MikeH92467 RadioNinja

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  7. Spaceturkey

    Spaceturkey i can see my house

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    I dunno... examples?
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  8. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    Biological:
    Blacks are much more likely to develop sickle cell disease than whites.

    Cultural:
    The Japanese are less likely to rely on social welfare systems than the English, despite the similarity of their systems.
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  9. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    Ohhhh, shiiiit, is he gonna pull out the phrenology skulls?
    Is he?
    Is he?
    :evilpop:
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  10. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    Yes it's fucking racist to say that black people are biologically less suited to success.
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  11. Spaceturkey

    Spaceturkey i can see my house

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    first one, sure.

    The second one requires expansion as to why that is and which similarities you mean.

    like, is there a social welfare system to rely on in the first place? If so, what does it provide in the way of supports? what's the GINI contrast on wealth inequity? while we're at it on similar systems, why is poverty in Japan growing at a steady rate?
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  12. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    My point is proven if you accept there are biological and cultural differences.
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  13. Rimjob Bob

    Rimjob Bob Sue Collini always gets the weenie

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    [Devil's advocate] But if it were true and provable, wouldn't that support social programs that are based in equity, as opposed to meritocracy? In other words, doesn't that have the potential to help underperforming groups and relief them of the "just bootstrap your way up" criticism?
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  14. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    I only say that behavior, being rooted in biology, shouldn't be dismissed as a factor in outcomes.

    And what about culturally?
  15. Spaceturkey

    Spaceturkey i can see my house

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    which point? you asked if "It's racist to say there are cultural and biological differences between racial groups?"

    a genetic predisposition to certain diseases? probably not going to get very much controversy.

    what cultural factors on the other hand can get messy without contexts like the ones I brought up.

    or of course, you can go with biology determining behavior as you do here... presuming inherent traits.

    this oughta be good.
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  16. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    The UN Declaration on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (1963) already addresses that:

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  17. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    What qualities do you posit that black people have, rooted in biology, that make them less inclined to the behaviors that lead to success?

    What about it? Racism is like taking a big dump in a batch of brownie mix. Whether or not the eggs are free ranged doesn't change the fact that you're gonna have a mouth full of shit.
    Last edited: May 30, 2022
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  18. Rimjob Bob

    Rimjob Bob Sue Collini always gets the weenie

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    Sure, but the question is not whether the policies to help those groups are racist. What I am suggesting is that the recognition of cultural or biological inferiority (which Paladin is positing and you're calling racist) could have utility for those groups if it leads to the policies you quoted.
  19. MikeH92467

    MikeH92467 RadioNinja

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    Does that make them inferior?
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  20. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    Not at all.
  21. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    The desirability of outcomes doesn't make something false into something true.
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  22. MikeH92467

    MikeH92467 RadioNinja

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    Just more susceptible to undesirable outcomes? :chris:
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  23. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    In that one particular dimension, yes.

    It would be unreasonable to expect every identifiable group to have equal levels of vulnerability to all diseases. Racial differences are evidence of separated human populations persisting over long periods of time, and as such we would expect mutation and natural selection to affect the genes of members of those populations in ways beyond the superficial. If your ancestors lived in areas with cows, you probably don't have the genetic disposition for lactose intolerance, for instance.
  24. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    There's a lot to unpack there.

    To what extent is behaviour rooted in biology? That's a centuries old debate. It is to some degree for human beings generally (we aren't a blank slate, some things are just innate to us, like language) but it is less clear to what extent it accounts for differences in behaviour between individual human beings, to say nothing of differences in behaviour between entire "racial groups". What is clear is that there is more variation within such groups than there are between them - so any attempt to draw wide-ranging social conclusions based on the differences between them is certainly flirting with racism.

    As for culture, any correlation between that and race is incidental.
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  25. Spaceturkey

    Spaceturkey i can see my house

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    mostly white sheets, it'd seem.

    well, that and drawing wide ranging social conclusions based on biological distinctions (real or otherwise) is also pretty boilerplate racist.
  26. Tererune

    Tererune Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    So basically even @Paladin agrees he is a racist at this point and now is just saying there is nothing wrong with his master race ideology.

    Where did I put that surprised face?
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  27. Jan Jansen

    Jan Jansen Ukraine Feline Defense Force

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    I hate his social Darwinist illusions, I don't like his brutalocapitalist views at all, but I guess deep down he's okay. He just needs a little love.

    A hard working American citizen with some weird ideas. Show a little respect! Stupid mob mentality...
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  28. Jan Jansen

    Jan Jansen Ukraine Feline Defense Force

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    He should get a girlfriend.
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  29. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

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    If I didn't want to be treated like a racist I simply wouldn't double down on explaining how I'm racist. :clyde:
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  30. Jan Jansen

    Jan Jansen Ukraine Feline Defense Force

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    Ok, he needs a BLACK girlfriend!
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