The Orville [SPOILERS WITHIN]

Discussion in 'Media Central' started by Tuckerfan, Aug 6, 2017.

  1. Uncle Albert

    Uncle Albert Part beard. Part machine.

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    We're due a decent episode with no scolding lectures. Maybe this time...
  2. Kommander

    Kommander Bandwagon

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    Ch***y's dead. Best episode ever.

    99/100

    Would have been a perfect score, but I deducted one point because there was a lot of Ch***y in this episode, and it wasn't enough they let her talk, but there was, *sigh* singing. If she hadn't died I'd have given this one a negative score and sued Disney for mental and emotional distress.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2022
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  3. Raoul the Red Shirt

    Raoul the Red Shirt Professional bullseye

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    On a superficial level, Domino was pretty enjoyable. But like a lot of things with this season if you think about it for a half-second, it makes no sense.

    There should be no reason for the Orville to risk taking their weapon to the heart of Kaylon territory with Isaac and Charly, the only two people who understand how to use it and who could build another one, on board.

    There should be no reason for the Kaylon to allow the Orville to come within their space with the weapon, with no counteroffensive, no more serious effort to destroy the Orville than we saw.

    Even if we want to go with, "The Orville wanted to demonstrate how powerful the weapon was and the only way to do that is to go into the heart of the Kaylon defenses and kill thousands of Kaylon," it makes no sense from either side's perspective that they would peacefully allow the Orville to land on the Kaylon homeworld and conduct the talks there with Isaac and Charly separated from the weapon that apparently only they can operate/figure out. The Kaylon should rightfully fear that this weapon that they cannot stop would be blown up in the heart of their civilization, and the Orville should rightfully fear that the Kaylon would kill or capture the diplomatic party making it impossible to use the weapon and worse, giving the Kaylon a chance to reverse-engineer it and figure out a way to defend themselves against it, or worse, figure out a way to turn it in to an offensive weapon against Union technology. They have video technology and nothing is to be gained from face-to-face talks in this instance.

    There is no real reason for the Moclan to attempt to ally with the Krill. From the Krill's perspective, the Moclans are just as much unbelievers as the rest of the Union, and thus needing to be subjugated/destroyed. And it is not like the Moclans have any more reason to think that the Krill, who they have been fighting for X number of years, are trustworthy. Are they so wedded to male supremacy that they wouldn't simply go back to the Union and work out something with them like, "Look, it sucks that we have been expelled from the Union, but we at least can work together to fight the Kaylon since they are planning to wipe all of us out?"
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  4. Lanzman

    Lanzman Vast, Cool and Unsympathetic Formerly Important

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    Agree. A great episode to watch, plot holes big enough to drive the whole Union fleet thru.
  5. Kommander

    Kommander Bandwagon

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    Also, they had less security on the Kaylon-Only Explody Device than the average liquor store has on their bottles of Fireball, and then they were surprised when it was stolen.
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  6. ed629

    ed629 Morally Inept Banned

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    Wow, Sam Malone really holds a grudge against Saavik going off with David to work with the Genesis Planet/Device.
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2022
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  7. We Are Borg

    We Are Borg Republican Democrat

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    Again, I get that The Orville is a riff on Star Trek (and particularly TNG). And this latest episode was enjoyable but ultimately empty, like an "Americanized" Chinese restaurant.

    But I think bringing Brannon Braga on board was a huge fucking mistake, because it now seems like he's just recycling ideas from TNG and VOY.

    Also, the series seems to have eschewed the parody aspect and become more straight-faced. Meh.
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  8. Ebeneezer Goode

    Ebeneezer Goode Gobshite

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    I'm not sure if this season is meant to be satirical, as opposed to the more blatant humour of seasons past, poking fun at tropes and plots in sci-fi we wave by because they'd fall apart at even a cursory inspection, or they've just decided to go with the tropes and plots in sci-fi we wave by because they'd fall apart at even a cursory inspection and we're not waving them by any more.

    I've enjoyed it, but if there's ever a S4 they need to get back on track.
  9. Uncle Albert

    Uncle Albert Part beard. Part machine.

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    I think ol' Seth there is getting too much of an ego and now feels the need to be taken seriously.
  10. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    The thing is that everyone seems to agree that he’s not a good actor. Even Seth seems to understand that since he gets the least amount of lines per episode. Maybe he wants the show to be taken more seriously, but they still insert juvenile humor when they can sooo…
  11. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    McFarlane, and by extension, The Orville, is a Mary Sue character. He couldn't get a main part on a Trek series, so he wrote his own with him as the captain.
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  12. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    I mean, hey, if you got that kind of power, go for it, but, it's still a Mary Sue character.
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  13. Tuckerfan

    Tuckerfan BMF

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    My thinking is that Seth had to pitch the series as a comedy to Fox in order to be able to do the pilot, but his goal from the beginning was to do his own version of Trek. So they shot the pilot with lots of gags to get Fox to buy the series. When they did, the writers' have gradually been aiming for a more serious show. One can argue if they're doing a good job of it, or if the world needs a Trek-clone, but I think that's what the plan was from the beginning.
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  14. Ebeneezer Goode

    Ebeneezer Goode Gobshite

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    You're quite likely correct, it's just a shame they've ejected the comedy bits rather than fold in the Trek cloneage.

    The whole treating being in NotStarfleetHonest as a job and a career, rather than just a calling, was nice, refreshing and relatable. I mean, no one's getting giddy to call their parents because they've got a red shirt gig on the Starfleet vessel that meter maids Jupiters orbit.

    IIRC there was an ep where Gordon was about to knock off, then something happened and it was "aw crap, more work" which I think pretty much everyone who has ever had a job can fully relate to a little bit more than Trek. I mean, I guess if your commute home is done on shrooms, your train may have been delayed by a giant ethereal hand, but for most people, no.
  15. Ebeneezer Goode

    Ebeneezer Goode Gobshite

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    They also missed out a doozy of a weapon that would have been entertaining to see in action - the time dingus.

    Send a Kaylon ship 5 minutes into the future, fire a torpedo at where it'll be, ship reappears with the torpedo never having to worry about the shields and just do its main job of blowing shit up.

    Have torpedoes move in and out of time...

    That could have really earned Charlie her spurs in 4 dimensional thinking.
  16. AlphaMan

    AlphaMan The Last Dragon

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    Just finished Ep 8 as I catch up with the rest of you. The one with Topa and Dolly Parton. I don't know how to describe it, but there's something about the show that's noticeably different since they switched to Hulu. It's not the special effects or CGI. I think that's noticeably better. But the stories aren't as tight as the ones that premiered on Fox. I felt like this show started off as a spoof of Star Trek, but towards the end of the first season, I think they came into their own.

    With that said, I don't find anything cringe inducing... yet. I plan to stick with the show.

    Ep 8, although full of plot holes and inconsistencies, I liked it. I almost shed a tear when Klyden came back and apologized for being a deadbeat to Topa. I really hope this show gets a shot at a 4th season.
  17. Raoul the Red Shirt

    Raoul the Red Shirt Professional bullseye

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    Have you met Charly? :)

    And yes, it seems like either Seth or Hulu decided to make the show more serious/action-adventurey, and that IMO hasn't worked too well.

    Of course, it could be that going back to earlier seasons will make it seem like those were flawed in similar ways. And it could be that while the earlier seasons fared well in comparison to ST: Discovery, in the interim, Trek has stepped up its game with Lower Decks and Strange New Worlds, and Orville's status as "best new Trek on TV" has fallen by the wayside.
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  18. Lanzman

    Lanzman Vast, Cool and Unsympathetic Formerly Important

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    What’s happened is that Mcfarlane has gotten self-indulgent.
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  19. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

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    I watched the first two episodes tonight and I agree that the Charly actress is fucking terrible. Gives me PTVSD from when a former boss used to hire reporters based on looks and not ability. This chick is awful. :jayzus:

    The run time on the first two episodes is too long, too. Especially the first one.

    I already miss the funnier Orville. Almost none of the cast has the chops to pull off the drama they're being asked to do.
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  20. Raoul the Red Shirt

    Raoul the Red Shirt Professional bullseye

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    I think that about half the cast could do drama within these type of roles well, or well enough. The only two actors who are not at all suited to a straight dramatic version are Seth and J. Lee, the Lamarr actor. Penny Jerald Johnson can obviously do it, as shown in DS9 and 24. Adrianne P. is fine for a dramatic version of Kelly. Peter Macon as Bortus would be good in a more dramatic version as well as in comic relief. Scott Grimes, the guy who plays Gordon is not nabbing any Emmys as a dramatic actor, but his role is also comic relief. The woman who plays Talia is fine too.
  21. Rimjob Bob

    Rimjob Bob Sue Collini always gets the weenie

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    Episode 9 -- the complete 180 on the Union's posture toward the Kaylon, in the span of one episode, was unforgivably bad writing.

    Also, they lazily used the bunker set from Episode 8 with altered lighting. It couldn't have been more obvious.

    Otherwise this season was strong, and I enjoyed it more than any recent Trek.
  22. We Are Borg

    We Are Borg Republican Democrat

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    I caught that, too, but it's a silly nitpick.

    It was a Moclan facility, so of course the bunker design will be similar (if not identical).
  23. We Are Borg

    We Are Borg Republican Democrat

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    You ain't seen nothing yet!
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  24. Amaris

    Amaris Witch of Winter

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    S03E10, "Future Unknown"

    POSITIVES
    * The opening music and Isaac bringing Claire a banana. That was cute.
    * The Moclan renewal ritual. I hope it catches on.
    * Isaac proposing. It was so sweet!
    * Sober Ed
    * Inviting the entire planet of Kaylons to the wedding.
    * Claire chewing out LaMarr was brilliant. I was backing away from the TV. :lol:
    * THE SANDWICH!
    * Elvis Bortus, and Klyden's adoration after the renewal is just too much. I love how precious it was. Also, "you may go."
    * Alara made a surprise visit! It was so good to see her again!
    * Malloy's the best toastmaster, but no one quiets a room faster like Bortus.
    * Scott's got a great voice, he's definitely a James Taylor / Stephen Bishop style singer, and it works.

    NEGATIVES
    * It may be the last episode of The Orville.

    RUMINATIONS
    If this is indeed the last episode of The Orville, I like the focus on the characters. I much prefer this giving us a softer, lighter character driven episode to end the season, and maybe the series, on, rather than some epic battle that leaves little time for anything else.

    I enjoyed watching Bortus and Klyden renew their commitment, and Klyden's renewed love for his husband was so very sweet. Some won't enjoy the Elvis joke, but I loved the hell out of it. Isaac wearing *just* a neck tie was *chef's kiss*, and I liked how the ladies were having a much better time with the Kaylon stripper. It was brilliant.

    Good points on the B story, too. How many of us haven't dreamed of being rescued by a benevolent alien species and whisked off to the stars, free from the often dystopic conditions in which so many people on earth live in every day? Kelly's points about how if Sargas was given advanced technology they'd just exploit people with it was spot on, IMO, and something to keep in mind, especially when I see our own people talking about how this or that technology will save us from ourselves. It just does not work like that.

    The Union isn't a utopia, contrary to what Lysella might thing. Getting to that point in civilization takes a hell of a lot of hard work, and constant vigilance. Certainly, from her perspective, and many of ours, it's vastly superior to what we face every day, but it's not a cakewalk. It requires effort, and a willingness to look outside yourself. A lot of humanity already has that quality, it's just most of the systems in which we live emphasize a hyper-individualism that sees other human beings as competitors, rather than as partners working to not only survive but to thrive.

    Lysella having survivor's guilt would also fit aptly. How well could many of us sleep knowing that while we escape poverty and war, the people we love will continue to live in it the rest of their lives? It would be difficult to reconcile with ourselves.

    The wedding was wonderful. Isaac is a snack, of course, and Claire's just gorgeous. I love the Union's version of the monster maroon formal dress, the reception was terrific, with Bortus being absolutely brutal and blunt by pointing out painful truths that threaten to rip open wounds and create a divide that would sow distrust amongst the wedding attendees.

    ALL KIDDING ASIDE.

    So if this has to be the end of the series, I think it's a touching one, a good one, and it gives us resolution. I sincerely hope for another season, but if not, I don't think it could have ended better than it did. Great work all around.
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  25. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I really liked this last episode, the brought the humor back and it was really good. Kelly and Ed holding hands at the end was a nice touch. Claire chewing out Lamar reminded me of the Admiral chewing out Kelly and Ed. Hopefully @AlphaMan doesn't have nightmares.:lol: McFarlane playing the dumb, useless man is a perfect role for him. He did this a little bit in A Million Ways to Die in the West, which is an underrated movie, IMO. Klyden is an annoying character, I could do without him. Ed got to make the Kirk speech from Balance of Terror. The Orville dress uniforms, I really like them. A little bit of TWOK mixed with the TNG movie dress uniforms. Another call back to Trek is Ed has a wrist communicator like Kirk's in TMP. I liked the call back to the social credit world and the girl who seeks asylum. I liked that Kelly showed her what happens when you give technology to a society that isn't ready for it. I don't think TNG ever actually did that. Picard mentions first contact with the Klingons which was shown in Enterprise, but that's about it. Prodigy is the only other example and I'm not sure we know the whole story on that yet. Overall, I think this season was a lot better than the previous two and I like the longer episodes. I like what they did with the show and I hope it gets renewed for another season. I do wonder if they are going to address Yaphid. Did Norm McDonald record a bunch of lines before he died or will we just not see the character again?
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  26. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

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    Episode 3 was enjoyable. A good story that took only as much time as it needed.

    Anne Winters is still a horrible actress. :bailey:
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  27. Amaris

    Amaris Witch of Winter

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    You hush, she's adorable.
    I mean, you're right, but you hush.
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  28. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

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    She's very cute if you're into that look, but should've stuck to modeling. :jayzus:
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  29. Amaris

    Amaris Witch of Winter

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    I agree.
  30. We Are Borg

    We Are Borg Republican Democrat

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    Well, that was a perfect end to a train wreck of season. Absolutely stupid episode and likely the final episode of the series.

    Other than the appearance of the sandwich, which was a nice touch, pretty much everything that happened in this episode was moronic on a level that I can't even begin to explain.

    There's an interesting parallel to Star Trek Discovery, in that season three is when that series also veered off the rails and crashed into Shitsville.

    It's a shame, because by season two The Orville had really found its feet and was a great sci-fi series. I think between season two and three the showrunners started drinking their own pee. I have no other explanation.