America Is Not Ready for a War with North Korea

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Dayton3, Aug 12, 2017.

  1. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Wonderful, Loving Husband & Father

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Messages:
    39,947
    Location:
    Norphlet, Arkansas
    Ratings:
    +17,652
    • Facepalm Facepalm x 1
  2. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    32,818
    Location:
    The inner workings of the id.
    Ratings:
    +997,472,660
    Live look inside Dayton's pants:

    IMG_5232.GIF
    • Funny Funny x 11
    • Winner Winner x 2
  3. Anna

    Anna Here for the Lulz Formerly Important

    Joined:
    May 17, 2005
    Messages:
    33,538
    Location:
    San Diego
    Ratings:
    +33,695
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  4. Tuckerfan

    Tuckerfan BMF Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    17,628
    Location:
    Space the final frontier
    Ratings:
    +18,865
    flaccid.jpg
    • Funny Funny x 7
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. Stallion

    Stallion Team Euro!

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2004
    Messages:
    8,804
    Ratings:
    +5,661
    Its ok. The coach is going to launch 100 nukes at NK!
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  6. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    19,520
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +7,714
    So maybe we shouldn't go to war with them?
    • Winner Winner x 7
    • Agree Agree x 5
  7. K.

    K. Sober

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    22,304
    Ratings:
    +19,670
    • Funny Funny x 3
    • Fantasy World Fantasy World x 1
  8. Aurora

    Aurora VincerĂ²!

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    26,720
    Location:
    Storage B
    Ratings:
    +8,416
    Yes, America is. But it's not ready for the ugliness of that war.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Eightball

    Eightball Fresh Meat

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2009
    Messages:
    1,402
    Location:
    here
    Ratings:
    +957
    We are not going to war with North Korea. We are being played. Trump and Kim talk shit to each other for a while then Russia swoops in and saves the day with a diplomatic solution and a grateful President Trump lifts the Maginsky act. Its all a show.
  10. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    19,520
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +7,714
    That would require an act of Congress, not Trump.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Eightball

    Eightball Fresh Meat

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2009
    Messages:
    1,402
    Location:
    here
    Ratings:
    +957
    Ya and?
  12. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    19,520
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +7,714
    Congress just forced through new sanctions on Russia with a veto-proof majority. There's no reason Russia jumping in with a diplomatic solution ends with the Magnitsky Act repealed, even if that's what Trump and Putin want.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. Federal Farmer

    Federal Farmer Anti-Federalist

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2013
    Messages:
    14,527
    Location:
    South Park, Colorado
    Ratings:
    +10,837
    It's pretty clear Congress and Trump aren't exactly working well with each other.
  14. Christopher

    Christopher There aren't enough redheads. Administrator Faceless Mook Writer

    Joined:
    May 7, 2010
    Messages:
    14,321
    Ratings:
    +11,948
    Well that's what happens when you don't hold the door open for such a lovely lady.
    • Funny Funny x 1
  15. Anna

    Anna Here for the Lulz Formerly Important

    Joined:
    May 17, 2005
    Messages:
    33,538
    Location:
    San Diego
    Ratings:
    +33,695
    We've only ever had two wars in our history that have seen fights in our backyard. Geographically speaking, we have two neutral countries on our borders and two large oceans on our coasts. We haven't faced a feasible threat since WWI.

    Which is why we have armchair generals such as Dayton Kitchens advocating for us to throw barely legal adults to fight for Uncle Sam. I'd normally add a line about him not giving a shit because it's not his kid in the fight, but Dayton is a retard who probably would be all to glad if his kid was going to see action on the front. :blink: Its easy to suggest military action when there's no chance of the other side rolling tanks down your street and seeing our country getting occupied.

    The closest we've come to having civilians feel the effects of war was the rationing and bond drives during WWII, and that was...what, going on eighty years ago? I work with a guy who's approaching ninety and despite being about ten years old when Pearl Harbor happened, he barely even remembers that, so those memories are leaving out of living memory very quickly.
  16. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    40,243
    Ratings:
    +18,013
    "America Is Not Ready for a War with North Korea"

    I told you that in the last thread, and even linked an Atlantic article which explained why in deep detail.
    • Winner Winner x 1
  17. Paladin

    Paladin Gunner Joe

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    39,315
    Location:
    Elsewhere
    Ratings:
    +37,918
    Ready or not, it may come to that. If we allow North Korea to threaten us or our allies in the region, we'll see a realignment of the region to China.

    I suspect the military part of the war--barring an intervention from China--would be the easier part. We'd take out their artillery near the DMZ, knock out their air defenses, destroy their air force (*chuckle*) on the ground, obliterate any massing troops, and systematically wreck their infrastructure. We'd make cruise missile strikes deep in their territory and would force their leadership underground.

    We don't want to take their territory, we only want to deal them a severe setback to their military. Maybe inspire someone to take initiative and cap Little Kim.

    Diplomatically, the game is very dangerous, as China has to respond if we go playing in their backyard.

    And if we hit them too hard or things go sideways and they collapse, we could have a very large humanitarian crisis on our hands.
  18. Elwood

    Elwood Your argument is invalid.

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    27,201
    Location:
    Unknown, but I know how fast I'm going.
    Ratings:
    +16,222
    See, I just don't see it. It's likely that North Korea could attempt to hit us now. Their Sinpo class submarines are capable of carrying one of the successfully tested Pukkuksong-1 short range (500km) nuclear armed ballistic missile. I dare say that the USN's ASW operations are nearly unparalleled by anyone else on the planet. But, the Pacific is a big ocean. That said, and maybe I'm naive, but I can't help but think that Kim's outbursts are just saber rattling turned up to 11 because he perceives President Trump to be weak.

    Also, there's already a large humanitarian crisis in North Korea. North Korea's government will, eventually, crumble. It would be convenient if it would crumble before there are nuclear arms for the different factions to grab. But... :shrug:
  19. Paladin

    Paladin Gunner Joe

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    39,315
    Location:
    Elsewhere
    Ratings:
    +37,918
    Oh, I don't think NK would actually be so suicidal as to hit us (and China's basically said they're on their own if they do), but this business of lobbing ballistic missiles over our allies' heads or near our territories is something we shouln't abide.

    I agree NK is testing Trump, but they really need to pull it back, because I'm quite certain Trump will pull the trigger.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. Elwood

    Elwood Your argument is invalid.

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    27,201
    Location:
    Unknown, but I know how fast I'm going.
    Ratings:
    +16,222
    Maybe I'm just naive, but this is what I'm seeing right now:

    [​IMG]
    • Funny Funny x 6
  21. Paladin

    Paladin Gunner Joe

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    39,315
    Location:
    Elsewhere
    Ratings:
    +37,918
    Maybe, but our allies in the region may see things differently.

    And, of course, once they threatened Guam, things got real.
  22. Zombie

    Zombie dead and loving it

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    37,645
    Ratings:
    +22,486
    Kim doesn't view Trump as weak. When's the last President to tell North Korea or anyone for that matter about "fire and fury"?

    North Korea probably hasn't expected Trump to act the way he has because let's face it Obama, Bush 43, and Clinton were pushovers. Those three didn't really do shit to stop North Korea.

    We are really stuck here. We can't hit first. China has already said they would jump to North Korea's side. North Korea is building nukes and rockets and no matter how much the naysayers want to poo-poo them the North Koreans are getting better at both. It really is only a matter of time before they can reliably field a nuclear tipped ICBM.

    And to make matters worse the North Koreans are working with Iran who themselves want nuclear weapons.

    It's going to be a hard few decades.
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  23. Elwood

    Elwood Your argument is invalid.

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    27,201
    Location:
    Unknown, but I know how fast I'm going.
    Ratings:
    +16,222
    I disagree. He can see the same news reports we can see. Trump can't get his signature piece of legislation anywhere in Congress. He's mired in scandal with a few cabinet appointments and the whole Russia thing. The country is more divided today than I've ever seen it in my lifetime. There are daily protests and counter protests. To a neutral observer, it could easily appear that President Trump has been more ineffective than any recent President during his first several months in office, especially when the President's party controls both houses of Congress.
    • Agree Agree x 5
  24. K.

    K. Sober

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    22,304
    Ratings:
    +19,670
    Kim's actions certainly suggest that he has less respect for Trump than he did for Obama.

    Which isn't any credit to Obama, since Kim is a totalitarian dictator with no morals. Just saying, if you want to know whom he considers strong or weak, just look at his actions towards each person.
    • popcorn popcorn x 1
  25. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 light & lethal

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2004
    Messages:
    59,439
    Location:
    Georgia, USA
    Ratings:
    +20,540
    Technically we aren't "at war"
    they threaten Guam because that's where we have an unbelievable amount of weaponry stored - it could conceivably be called a "military target" and no doubt Kim will use that to justify any military actions taken there. If I were Trump I'd say "yes, please fire missiles toward Guam! We always need more realistic training - it would be a great way to test our defense systems against an actual legitimate threat in the future!" :D
  26. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2004
    Messages:
    18,047
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Ratings:
    +11,048
    It's hard to see how this ends well.

    Wonder what the minimum point is where China will abandon North Korea. Would a NK missile failing as it flies over Japan and crashing there be enough?
    • Sad Sad x 1
  27. Zombie

    Zombie dead and loving it

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    37,645
    Ratings:
    +22,486
    It would be nice if that was enough to get China to step in but I don't think China wants to step into North Korea. China doesn't want to deal with that clusterfuck of a headache. What happens if Kim freaks out and nukes China? I wouldn't put it past him. Any move by China to take over the country is sure to result in him and those around him losing power.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  28. Bailey

    Bailey It's always Christmas Eve Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2004
    Messages:
    18,047
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Ratings:
    +11,048
    Unless NK actually attacks China I don't think they will step in, but they have certainly been making noises lately about not stepping in to help them if they really fuck up.
  29. Elwood

    Elwood Your argument is invalid.

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    27,201
    Location:
    Unknown, but I know how fast I'm going.
    Ratings:
    +16,222
    If an unarmed North Korean missile was to "fail" and crash into a populated area in Japan, I certainly see China telling North Korea that they're on their own. Japan would retaliate and be justified in doing so.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  30. We Are Borg

    We Are Borg Rey of sunshine

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2004
    Messages:
    11,887
    Location:
    Canada
    Ratings:
    +12,882
    FTFY. :yes:
    • Agree Agree x 1