California Funds Nation's First Inmate Sex Change Surgery

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Shirogayne, Jan 7, 2017.

  1. Shirogayne

    Shirogayne Gay™ Formerly Important

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    http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/20...ations-first-inmate-sex-reassignment-surgery/
    Shiloh Heavenly Quine (who among many other bad decisions in her life goes with the worst white trashiest stripper name ever :soma: ) is serve a life sentence for a murder in 1980, has attempted suicide over this five times and had tried cutting her penis off even before going to prison. She'll be transferred to a women's facility following the procedure.
  2. Zombie

    Zombie dead and loving it

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    A complete waste of taxpayer money. Unacceptable.

    Let Shiloh raise the funds for the operation.
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  3. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Queue @Nova to tell us it's a health issue and he'll die if tax payers don't pay for the surgery.
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  4. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    that 100,000 figure is utter bullshit.

    It's expensive for the average person, ranging from $15k to $30k, but the HRT afterwords is negligible (like a woman who's had a hysterectomy would take) and the HRT before, as well as the psychological evaluations, are already sunk cost in her case. But still wouldn't add up to more than a few thousand over the long term. No reason they couldn't get all this done for under $40k

    In other words, given the entire population of California that's 1/10 of 1 cent per person. Even at the 100k figure it would be 1/4 of 1 cent per person, per subject.

    I'm sure the state will survive. Hell, let me send them a penny so the survivor won't have to contribute to it.
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  5. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    1/10 of 1 cent per capita.
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  6. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    well, given she already tried to die several times, it's certainly not impossible.

    Given that 40% of those of us still alive tried, and god only knows how many succeeded without us ever knowing why, yeah, it really is that serious.

    given that every study reflects that every measure of quality of life and positive outcome improves dramatically after transition, yes, there's plenty of evidence that it's a legitimate health concern. Despite the opinion of self-appointed internet experts who know basically nothing about the subject.
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  7. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I know I'm not going to die if I don't cut off my penis. Considering he's a convicted murderer, I have little sympathy if he's suicidal. The guy is not going to die from external forces, his life is only in danger from his own self.
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  8. Zombie

    Zombie dead and loving it

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    Irrelevant.

    It's taxpayer funds for an operation that is not necessary.
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  9. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    :yes: Speaking as a Californian, that's nothing.

    I would gladly pay a whole penny to chop off some murderer's dick.
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  10. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    Honestly, this is a complete waste of taxpayer money and never should have occurred. It is a good thing the court of appeals overturned the retarded ruling that taxpayer had to pay for elective surguries for criminals.
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  11. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    That incompetent murdering piece of shit can't even get it right after five tries? Why not just hang that murderer or provide him with a razor blade to slit his wrists with? Paying $100,000 tax payer dollars is a crime and an outrage and, yes, the reporters probably got it right when you account for transport costs and paying cops to escort him around.

    Zero sympathy. That murdering piece of shit should have been executed long ago not given a $100,000 gift.
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  12. The Original Faceman

    The Original Faceman Lasagna Artist

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    I assure you the $100,000 figure is not bullshit. You have failed to calculate the security and the weeks of rehab that does not take place in a prison.
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  13. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    So if a MURDERER doing a life sentence is suicidal this is a problem why exactly? :chris: They fucking murdered someone - I'm sure there are inmates worthy of spending money on to keep them happy so they won't commit suicide - but this guy isn't one of them. He tried to cut off his penis - I'm not seeing a "try" situation here. It's not like cutting someone's head off with that thick spinal column - if something is sharp enough to cut even part of a penis it will cut the rest of it too.
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  14. The Original Faceman

    The Original Faceman Lasagna Artist

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  15. Scott Hamilton Robert E Ron Paul Lee

    Scott Hamilton Robert E Ron Paul Lee Straight Awesome

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    He will be, you should say.
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  16. Shirogayne

    Shirogayne Gay™ Formerly Important

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    No.

    :)
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  17. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    If you have a penis you are not a chick. If a man cuts off his penis he is a eunich and still not a woman. He will never have two X chromosomes no matter how much make believe he plays.
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  18. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    If you fail at suicide five times, you're not doing it right.
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  19. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    that's not the point. I have no specific sympathy for this woman, given her crimes, but as a society we have chosen that we will not force those we incarcerate to suffer. If a person in prison has, say, a herniated disc in their back that causes them considerable intense pain, but they are not going to die from it, we COULD say "well you are a murdering asshole so deal with it" but as a society we hold ourselves to a higher standard so we pay for the surgery to remedy the pain, regardless of whether the prisoner "deserves" relief.

    Same difference here.

    The reason I take the position I do is because I recognize the condition is just as legitimate, and if you once concede it's not the same because the person is in prison, then you've conceded it's not legitimate anywhere else.

    If you want to argue that NO prisoner EVER should receive treatment for non-life threatening suffering, then I'll simply say we disagree and move on. But my point is that if you act to alleviate suffering, as a matter of policy, then this is legitimate suffering and deserves the same consideration.
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  20. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    see answer above, how do you define "necessary"?

    (and yes, it's relevant. If you can alleviate suffering for an inconsequential cost, you're an awful human being if you choose not to)
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  21. Zombie

    Zombie dead and loving it

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    We already went through this nonsense argument in a previous thread.

    Taxpayer money should never be used for a sex change operation. Ever.

    You want to give this inmate a sex change? Set up a Gofundme and pay for it yourself.
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  22. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    See above. I'm making a case, y'all are just saying "I don't like it"
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  23. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    and the back surgery?
  24. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    when was the last time your sex chromosomes were checked? Have you ever met someone who had had such a test?

    Chromosomes do not drive any other choice we make in life and, apart from certain fertility issues, are irrelevant to every day of your life post-birth.

    I can show you a documented case of a person born with a vagina, apparently and assumed to be female all her life, with XY chromosomes. With some hormone treatments she was able to conceive, carry to term, and deliver a daughter - also XY. In your view both these individuals are male, right?

    Here's the thing Simple Simon, biology is more complex than what you learned in middle school.
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  25. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    Oh, I know rare mutations and aborations exist but the fact remains that a eunich is not a woman no matter how much he wishes he was.
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2017
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  26. Shirogayne

    Shirogayne Gay™ Formerly Important

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    Never met a runich, no matter how often I've visited Hillcrest. :no:
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  27. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    it's fascinating how so many have such confident opinions on something they have no knowledge or experience with.

    Here's just one possibility - person attempts and passes out from the pain before they finish.

    Y'all don't want to think about these things before you speak because you have already gotten comfortable with an opinion.

    Be it Ron Pual who's convinced it is wrong even though he can supply no objective argument supporting it

    Or Dinner who's convinced the the penis is central to all of life despite obvious holes in that sort of thinking

    Or the folks who say "I'm against it because this is a murderer" but they wouldn't be against it for any procedure they respect (which translates to "anything that I myself might ever need"

    Just knees jerking all over the room.
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  28. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    are you under the impression that trans people are not rare?
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  29. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    Of course, because they'll never have to worry about experiencing it, so it's unnecessary. Look how difficult it is to get healthcare for women funded because so many of the men in Congress find it a waste of taxpayer resources.
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  30. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    I will accede that I do not have the experience necessary to do that math. However, no one stays weeks in recuperation in a hospital that would require off-site housing. A week at most, based on what I know from great many people who've had the procedure.

    Still, 1/4 of 1 cent then. Still negligible.

    Assuming the estimated rate of trans in the population, calculated against the CA prison population and assuming even distribution, and assuming all cases were out and pre-op and asking for the full course of treatment, that would be 1,120 case. Given the number of available surgeons and the usual rate of 3-4 operations per week, that would take about 3 years to do all of them and would cost each citizen $2.80 over the course of three years combined, or about 93 cents a year.

    That's before you deduct for the fact that a post-op person needs far less maintenance treatment and mental health services and so forth which, by one calculation, would cost the prison system even more on a decades long basis than the $100,00 figure.
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