Texas GOP adopts platform supporting gay - conversion therapy

Dayton wants society like his Start Trek, the one he wants and he'll coerce, convert, and relentlessly shove his point to ruin the enjoyment of others until he gets the one he wants. Just like he did with Enterprise.

So he wants it with no women, so that men can "just be themselves," and yet claims this somehow isn't gay.

Is that what his bitch about women in Star Trek is? That the menfolk can't "just be themselves"? Dayton. Dude. If the presence of women renders you unable to "be yourself", fella, you just ain't much of a man.

My lord exploiting gay-to-straight conversion programs could be awesome!

"Excuse me - I've seen the light and I want to be straight. But I'm still unsure, I still have reservations. I think if you could put me in room with several hot young willing ladies, that just might seal the deal on my conversion, or at least get me started! Of course you'd have to film it, so I can study and critique my activities in depth."

Of course you can't completely "be yourself" around any women you are interested in any more than ladies can be themselves. You always try to put on a good impression. We all have a "date face" where we are on our best behavior. That's why office romances kick ass IMO. You see how people really are when are in a non-social situation and interacting with many people on a different level. Anyone can act great for the duration of a date. But on a day-to-day basis what is that person all about? Damn I'm getting myself all excited! Luckily my workplace is almost all male, or I might get myself in trouble! You know else is sexy? Grocery store clerks! You get a minute or two to say witty things and make some brief but non-invasive eye contact. The clerks might see you in the store a lot so they know you're financially and mentally stable.
DAMN! That's it, I'm putting on my most distinguished hat and making a beer run to the Food Lion or maybe BiLo.

That's just...

Uh...

Never mind. Carry on.

[quote: ed629, post: 2619380, member: 162"]

Dayton wants society like his Start Trek, the one he wants and he'll coerce, convert, and relentlessly shove his point to ruin the enjoyment of others until he gets the one he wants. Just like he did with Enterprise.[/quote]
His attitude towards Enterprise shows how self important he is. He was far from the show's only critic and most were more intelligent about it than I'm sure Dayton every was.

Coincidentally, I respected and liked Stewey (probably the most notorious basher during its run) enough to sign uphere after he got banned from TBBS and I still liked the show for years after that before discovering DS9. Funny how that goes.

Edit: I hate this new platform because it still jumps up and cuts into quote tags when posting from my phone

There was plenty to hate about Enterprise. There was also plenty about the 4th season to redeem it. It's just too bad that, by then, it had started to be redeemed too late.

In my opinion, if you have to wait for a television series 3rd or 4th season to "get good", then the original concept was not that solid to begin with.

Couldn't disagree more! Especially with a show containing multiple characters of well developed/written personas.
IMO the best way you can gauge a shows success is in the long haul. Sadly some shows are great but get the plug pulled way, way too early. But once a show lasts a few seasons, the earlier episodes are CRAP compared to hitting their stride/peak. It's beyond the scope of this thread, but I can come up with multiple examples of the benefits of giving a show time to ripen.

TNG started off slow, so did DS9. I think those shows are pretty solid.

I like giving shows a few seasons to find their footing. To me, insanity is pouring a ton of money into a new pilot, getting 3 episodes off the ground, only to be canceled by the studio because not enough people were watching. I mean, bloody hell, I don't find out about some shows until they're in their 3rd or 4th season, let alone 3rd or 4th episode!

Ever seen The TV Set? Its a pretty scathing look at how TV shows are made by the guy responsible for Freaks and Geeks (and the son of Lawrence Kasdan). That we get anything of quality is pretty much a miracle.

However, I will say that the first couple of seasons of Enterprise were painful to watch.

I'll have to see if I can find it. Netflix didn't have it, so a quick look is in order.

Had either of those primered fourth in a decades old franchise, I'd bet they'd gotten the axe, too. TNG season 1 and 2 benefitted from being the first Trek in 20 years and DS9 benefitted from following behind TNG's success.

But that said, they did get better eventually, something that can't be said for Voyager and by the time someone started putting effort into Enterprise, it was far too little and much too late.

Well if you want to get technical, SeaQuest DSV (2032) had a short third (and last) season that was actually pretty decent. But it was too late to save the show.

By the way, has anyone noticed that you seem to seldom see television shows that last two or three seasons?

If they are not canceled within the first year (generally with less than 10 episodes) then they have a really great chance of going five years or more? Is it because after getting renewed a couple of times, the studios see an opportunity for syndicating them endlessly?

And the incredibly frustrating thing about that is that when effort finally was being put into it, it was actually really good -- which just sort of reminds me that it could've been good the whole time. Everything was there for a really good Trek prequel series... except that B&B didn't give a shit about making a really good Trek prequel series. They just couldn't be assed to put the work in, creatively. Fuckers.

I blame Paramount/UPN as much as the idiocy twins. They pushed for making a sexier Trek which in itself isn't bad, but the decon scene. UPN also nixed the idea of Voyager having a year of Hell that lasted longer than a two part episode.

All the more reason for Trek VI to go on cable. HBO will have a hole to fill after True Blood ends this season.

Oh yeah, Alexander Skaagard will be free to play the sexiest Captain to ever sexy on Trek!

only we could turn a discussion of anti-gay politics into a discussion of Star Trek

In reverse fairness to the "idiocy twins" (Berman & Braga I presume) it has always been the traditional role of the producers to FIGHT network interference when they think it harms their show. Such as when Roddenberry refused to give in on various issues (such as having Spock smoking cigarettes while on duty).

Even still, a producer's only gonna get so much, even it it's the number one show on the network (which I doubt Voyager was by that point and Enterprise never was).

The only reason TIIC in Paramount allowed for arc based stories on Enterprise was cuz ratings were complete shit and needed them high enough for a fourth season syndication package. If Les Moonves had taken over Viacom three month sooner, there wouldn't even have been that.

Exactly. They forgot what made Trek successful, and sex appeal might have been part of it, but only purely by accident. I recall reading that women started getting all damp in the panties over Spock, but that it caught the creatives of the time completely flat-footed. When B&B busted out Seven of Nine, and then T'Pol, they were trying to recreate with a sledgehammer what the TOS did accidentally with a scalpel.

Now, see, that I might've watched. A whole season of those horrible, unlikeable characters suffering and dying off? Who wouldn't have tuned in for that? Sure, by then we would all have known that there'd be a reset button -- but had we been given more time before they mashed it, more viewers might've gotten interested.

Everything is about Star Trek from some angle or another.

Also, UPN was behind the push to keep all the familiar Trek technology, and to make the show more "futuristic", which resulted in the Temporal Cold War storyline.

IIRC, Brannon Braga was asked about why Enterprise had all the familiar Trek technology despite being set a century earlier and he simply said "fans want to see cool stuff".

Ever have a feeling that Braga, Berman and the rest never had the slightest clue about Star Trek fans?

Considering how much they dumbed the show down in spite of it being very well known that many scientists and engineers were inspired to take up those careers by Star Trek, yeah.

Arguably, the only Star Trek show that was good in the very first season was TOS. TNG and DS9 took two or three seasons to reach the awesome that we all remember, and of course Voyager never had more than an episode here or there that was good. Aside from it being authentically Star Trek, Voyager pretty much never got good. Enterprise was better than TNG season 1, and pretty much any season you want to pick from Voyager.

DS9 was still incredibly strong in its first season, even managing to produce one of the best hours of Trek ever aired in "Duet."

I'd put DS9 and TOS about equal for strength of the first season.

And, oddly, if you look at how well the first season did compared to the rest of the series, Season 1 of Voyager didn't do that badly. Yes, it was still Voyager, and no, it wasn't great. But it came out of the box with as much steam as it was ever able to muster.