thinking the media is way off on the details here.....

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by oldfella1962, Nov 24, 2017.

  1. Quincunx

    Quincunx The Least Knotted of All Knots Staff Member Administrator

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    Was this guy really hunting? He was taking potshots from his backyard.
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  2. Man Afraid of his Shoes

    Man Afraid of his Shoes كافر

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    Probably the latter.
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  3. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    About deer hunting? Or about deer hunting with a handgun at unrealistically long distances? Granted nothing wrong with taking a 200 yard pistol shot on a mature white tail deer (and large bodied deer at that, northern deer being larger than southern deer on average) which apparently makes sense to many wordforge hunters despite not being practiced by handgun hunters in general, who like the extra challenge of having to get closer to deer, thus limiting their effective range. But hey, whatever floats your boat I guess! :cool:
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  4. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/26/nyregion/hunter-shot-woman.html

    so he was a neighbor who thought he saw deer :huh: and shot in the general direction of the shapes/shadows/shuffling noises/whatever. Yes, he must have taken the Hunter Safety Course at some point (at his age, though old timers are "grandfathered") if had a hunting license - it's a requirement. So it's not like he was out hunting in his stand/blind and as it got dark the deer finally showed up - that would be (I guess) something that would possibly be understood if not condoned.
    So it seems for now at least that it wasn't an experienced hunter taking a 200 yard shot with a hand gun (which is apparently a feasible thing among some wordforge deer hunters!) :yes:
  5. Man Afraid of his Shoes

    Man Afraid of his Shoes كافر

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    Dear hunting in general. The fact that you still insist that 200 yards is an unrealistically long distance proves my point.

    If 150 yards is considered moderate range for handgun hunters, then it apparently is being practiced by handgun hunters in general.
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  6. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    You may be right about me being wrong on handgun hunting! I just asked about handgun deer hunting distances on an outdoor forum I frequent so I'll see what these handgun hunters say about effective distance from their experiences. Hopefully I get some feedback.
  7. Forbin

    Forbin Do you feel fluffy, punk?

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    Best I can get on the weapon is "single shot pistol."

    Waiting for the call for a ban on "deadly single shot sniper pistols" or "sawed off sniper rifles."
  8. Cobalt

    Cobalt USA International

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    I found this article on the shooting, that was published today, Monday 11/27.

    http://buffalonews.com/2017/11/27/c...st-sherman-hunter-who-mistook-woman-for-deer/

    It says that the district attorney is considering filing charges against the shooter.

    Charges could be second degree manslaughter, based on reckless conduct,
    which could have sentence of five to fifteen years;

    or, criminally negligent homicide, which could have sentence of up to four years.

    The weapon fired was a Thompson/Center Contender pistol.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
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  9. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    YES! Put this fucker away! I really can't see any mitigating circumstances here. He wasn't legally hunting and this woman (and dog) popped out into his shooting lane or anything. Hunting after dark in a populated area with a low IQ - what can go wrong? :jayzus: I hunt in a populated area - every bow hunter on Fort Gordon Ga does too. But we all obey the safety rules so this shit doesn't happen! Actually over the years hunting in general has gotten more & more safe. Back in the day hunters would while in tree stands (wearing blaze orange) by other hunters. :facepalm: So I guess with hundreds of thousands of hunters afield it's a mathematical certainty that a handful will be idiots. Damn I hope this motherfucker gets a maximum sentence. :yes:
  10. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    UPDATE! Apparently handgun hunters in Georgia are pussies. I got a bunch of responses from Georgia handgun hunters (people who...you know.... actually hunt & kill deer with handguns of various calibers) and none of them take shots past 150 yards with the majority limiting their shots to well under 100 yards, many under 50 yards. :huh: Hopefully they step up their game and start taking those 200 yard shots that are so common among the rest of the US handgun hunters according to word forge! They must be stuck on developing their hunting skill set to get closer to the deer, because hunting with a long gun isn't challenging enough. But hey, what do they know? :shrug: Just putting that out there!
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  11. Man Afraid of his Shoes

    Man Afraid of his Shoes كافر

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    Dang it! My multiple links have been bested once again by second hand anecdotal evidence. :(
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  12. Tererun

    Tererun Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    Wait, was he hunting within 500 yards of a domicile or road? Because if he was that is illegal in NY under conservation laws. Granted I think it is a misdemeanor with up to a year in jail, but it is illegal to take that shot. It should be pretty easy to establish that charge if he did, and these sorts of incidents are why they make those laws to force you away from shooting near roads and homes. It might be five hundred feet. The district attorney should be charging him with those charges even if they decide not to charge him with the homicide. Oh, and those charges will count against you for your new York pistol license so they would take his pistol so he cannot hunt like an idiot with a legally purchased pistol anymore. Yes, I do happen to know those ny laws as they include language which restricts paintball guns around highways and houses also.
  13. Tererun

    Tererun Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    How the fuck are you going to hunt those gangland dear in downtown Atlanta with a rifle? Those bucks have fully auto uzis so you better have a glock or better or stay the fuck home and leave og Peter cottontail alone unless you want to end up in a box my nigga.

    Peace out
  14. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    I'm not linking because I don't want the hunters on the site thinking I'm just using their experiences to prove a point on another site - again, they all limit their handgun hunting distances so they aren't as awesome as those small fraction of handgun hunters who take 200 yard shots. Then again their deer "recovery rates" are no doubt much better since they don't lose as much kinetic energy limiting their shot distances. Just like guys who take 70 yard crossbow shots on deer - just because it can be done doesn't mean it should be done.
  15. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    :lol: seriously though the Atlanta area does have some HUUUUUGE bucks harvested every year. The suburbs that are "archery only" for safety reasons grow a lot of Forbin style "yard deer" that grow fat at the expense of people's gardens, flowers, bushes, big old oak tree acorns, etc.
  16. Forbin

    Forbin Do you feel fluffy, punk?

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    Not a very good report on the single shot guns used for the 500 meter shots, but I'm limited in what I can do here at work.



    The asshole reporter is holding a classic Remington XP-100 with vinyl stock during his lying-down reporting. Like the Contender, that's specifically made for very long range accuracy.
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  17. Forbin

    Forbin Do you feel fluffy, punk?

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    We need to strike "opened fire" from reporters' lexicon. Can you even call it "opening fire" when you're only firing one shot? "Opening" makes it sound like something you're doing for a while.

    The description of the gun seems intentionally pejorative. "basically a rifle!" "Classed as a pistol because it's just shorter than a rifle!!!"
    TC comes in various barrel lengths, but I think 16" barrel is about average and can go down to 10 or 12. "Just" shorter than a carbine, maybe. And with a pistol grip and no shoulder stock, it's not exactly "basically a rifle."
  18. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    yeah it might be 500 feet - that's reasonable. In Georgia it's 50 yards I think. Where I hunt on Fort Gordon GA it's 100 yards/300 feet from a "named" road or occupied building, even with a bow. Regardless if the guy was far enough from a road or home,
    he was shooting well after dark and didn't identify his target - I don't see any mitigating circumstances that would help him out. I hope they throw the book at him!
  19. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    It's a longer than average pistol, but still a pistol. It gives you more range (retains a bit more down-range energy and accuracy) than a typical hunting handgun. If he's not criminally charged - just how fucked-up does a hunter have to be in NY to get into real trouble?
  20. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    that would be a cool way to hunt (laying down) but you might fall asleep before the deer show up. :lol:
  21. Tererun

    Tererun Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    What they should do is take a deer target and have him stand next to it while a hunter goes out two hundred yards and takes a shot at the target with him right there. Perhaps that will get it through his head why he should verify his target and not take such long shots with pistols.
  22. ohdeve the obvious dual

    ohdeve the obvious dual FUCK YO GRAPES!

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    They should make him squeal like a pig, boy! Squeal like a pig!
  23. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    "What they should do is take a deer target and have him stand next to it while a hunter goes out two hundred yards and takes a shot at the target with him right there. Perhaps that will get it through his head why he should verify his target and not take such long shots with pistols."

    I totally agree! Make sure they shoot after legal "shooting light" too. :D
  24. shootER

    shootER Insubordinate...and churlish Administrator

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  25. Tererun

    Tererun Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    I figure they were just taking their time nailing down the evidence and following procedure. You have to figure they needed to be sure there was no premeditation or motive they could find to charge him with murder instead of manslaughter. That could take a few days of investigation to make sure he did not want to shoot her so they would go with the manslaughter charge. Unless I hear otherwise I figure that was why they waited.
  26. Tererun

    Tererun Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    Given it was probably some impatient dumb ass shot two people's lives will now be wrecked. He really did not have to take an iffy shot and her life is done. Her family and friends will never be with her again. He is probably going to jail on a felony manslaughter rap and has to live with this. His family and friends will miss him. All for what? Because he couldn't take a moment to confirm his recreational shot.

    This is why I feel there has to be a high standard on recreational gun usage. You just cannot fix this tragedy. He not be able to take it back or make it right no matter how much he wanted to. It is one of the reasons I was a real nutbuster at my paintball field and when I worked for others. I could not work for the local floriduh field it was a fucking accident waiting to happen and someone was going to get permanently hurt. The boss was very clear he did not want me bothering the players with safety. If someone loses an eye or breaks a bone because I just let shit go they have to live with that and no game is worth a permanent blinding or injury. It may still happen, but I am not letting safety slide because it is not happening on my shift.

    There are good hunters who I think are really safe. There are so many more impatient dumbfucks running around with lethal weapons. More and more I find that I feel a good hunter's right to that entertainment does not equal the damage done that can never be repaired because we let way to many idiots do as they please.
  27. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    "There are good hunters who I think are really safe. There are so many more impatient dumbfucks running around with lethal weapons. More and more I find that I feel a good hunter's right to that entertainment does not equal the damage done that can never be repaired because we let way to many idiots do as they please."

    "This is why I feel there has to be a high standard on recreational gun usage."

    There's an old saying that applies here: YOU CAN LEAD A HORSE TO WATER BUT YOU CAN'T MAKE HIM DRINK.
    In other words, all the training/testing/education/vetting in the world cannot prevent that .001 percent of the population from doing incredibly & fatally stupid
    shit. If we (for example) made getting a driver's license incredibly difficult, people would still get killed on the road by totally preventable crashes. Hundreds of thousands of people here in Georgia (like many states) legally hunt & shoot recreationally. Only tiny fraction of these people are involved in fatal mishaps.
  28. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    So he was looking for yard deer?
  29. oldfella1962

    oldfella1962 the only real finish line

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    speaking of deer, I was hunting sunday afternoon and had a deer come through my AO to my 5:00. It was in range and working it's way right past my position
    then I realized it was pretty small and alone. I realized it was just a fawn - short nose & stubby legs. Most likely a young male, born around May 2017 or so - as soon as the males are old enough to fend for themselves the moms push them away to live on their own and (eventually) find does to mate with and explore new areas. While perfectly legal when bow-hunting, I won't shoot a deer that hasn't had a chance to even live yet & experience life. Hopefully next time I hunt there some older deer will come through!