Agreement with North Korea

Could be good, could be just words. But it seems like a positive step. NK is both agreeing to stop it's nuclear missile program and admitting it can't even feed its own people.

But ... but ... but ... something good can't happen! Stuttering clusterfuck of a miserable failure!

And here I would have thought that you, at least, would have something worthwhile to contribute to the discussion.

So we give them the food and they start right back up again. We've done this before and it seems will do it again.

Who knows maybe the son is not as stupid as his dad and realizes that you can't run a country where everyone is dead from starvation.

Probably just another bullshit ploy by the NKs.

Yeah. Those who fail to learn from history will continue to get extremely worked up over repetitions, won't they?

Good moves. Especially so soon after Triple Kim came into power. There was a lot of worry that he would be so weak that he'd have to saber rattle for a couple years until the got enough of the regime barons behind him that he could negotiate from a position of (relative) strength.

The only concern I have is that part of the condition for Food Aid is that we get to send 100 Korean speaking Americans over to supervise the disbursement. In the past the Military has taken nearly all of it. Now, don't get me wrong, supervision is a good thing, but I'm not sure how I feel about 100 Americans being in NK. What happens if shit goes bad and Triple Kim decides they are all 'spying' and grabs them up as a bargaining chip? :/

It's something to watch. The death of Kim il Jong might have been a huge help to ensure that the North Koreans are serious about it this time. On the other hand, it could be more of the same that we've seen.

For some reason no Kim Il Jong makes me more optimistic but granted I don't know much about his successor.

Good point, but I don't think that is likely to happen. He might trump up some charges on one or two of them, but holding 100 Americans hostage? That would amount to a declaration of war on the USA, and I don't think even the North Koreans are willing to risk something like that.

Good as far as it goes. Which ain't all that far. Still it's a step, however small, in the right direction. If the fat kid isn't batshit insane like his old man (may he rot in Hell) maybe there's hope...I agree the pattern under the old bastard was to do just enough to get the food rolling in then start back up again. All we can do is wait and see...

I will be interested to hear the right wing echo chamber spin on this.

Why does anyone think the North Koreans have any intention of living up to their part of the agreement.

That pretty well sums up my outlook as well. It's not something to get all excited about, but it certainly isn't a bad thing. But we still better keep a careful eye on them.

Those are my thoughts. However, those making these decisions have access to information we don't. Maybe there is something on the new Kimmie to indicate he will respond differently to this than his father did.

I'm not sure what we can do other than try and regulate what we give vs. what we get very closely.

North Korea can basically do what they want with impunity. We're not going to touch them unless they launch an invasion of the south.

"Let them STARVE!!!"

There's a new leader now, and he's already shown he's more flexible than his father was?

How exactly has he shown this?

His father made this same deal during the Clinton years.

They can't fight much on an empty stomach. And once they cross the border and see how good the south has it, they'll mutiny and switch sides.

Has he? Honest question.

Honest question, did he renege during the Clinton years or during the GWB years?

Didn't he agree to share power instead of ruling as supreme, unquestioned leader like his father and grandfather?

No kidding. So the military will get available food, while civilians starve.

Wrong. The south won't have it "good" after the artillery bombardments. There won't be anything left to want. You're rather uninformed on this issue, perhaps you should go read.

Not really. It's certainly a hopeful sign, but with North Korea, who knows?

This. New regime, run by a kid barely out of his teens, who's been beyond the borders and seen that the myth his father created is 110% bullshit.

If there is a chance to let a little light in to this desolate country, now's the time.

That's the thing, everyone wasn't starving equally. There was a great specialist giving a talk on C-SPAN and essentially it was the least valuable who the regime was letting starve (the old, the young without connected parents, rural people who don't produce enough) and not those who produce for the regime (factory workers, farmers on the best land, city people with strong regime loyalty, etc...) so there was a method to the madness. The same guy said it would be virtually impossible to get them to give up nuclear weapons because military strength is the last pillar the regime has to stand on the first kim had three pillars to justify his legitamacy, fighting the Japanese for independence, economic progress, and military strength. When the USSR collapsed and stopped sending aid they had just 2 pillars as the economy tanked then when the first kim died they were down to one pillar.

Basically the regime knows that without confrontation with the west and the bragging rights of nuclear weapons there is no reason for it to exist and it couldn't even justify it's existence to it's own people. They're not going to commit suicide so they won't give them up and not even China can make them give it up. Hell, the Chinese don't really even like the North Korean regime but don't want US forces on their border so the best thing we can do is make some agreement for the US forces not to move North and see if we can get China to cut NK's aid off.

The Chinese are less concerned about "American forces on their border" than they are with millions of desperate, starving NKs flooding over it. And it remains to be seen if li'l Kim is really in charge, or if he's just a figurehead for the military.

I don't think he agreed to anything. Being a kid and bring a recent selection for succession he is just not as powerful as his father. Sharing power with the military is not a better option anyway.

That he had the sense to recognize that, instead of trying to be the next dictator and suffering the consequences, shows you he's flexible enough to realize when compromising is the right choice.

Better than putting all the power in the hands of one deluded nutjob, certainly.

^ It had nothing to do with sense. He had no choice. He'll consolidate his power over the next couple of years and take full control (barring an unexpected end to the whole NK regime).