2016 Presidential Election Thread

Election results are no necessarily evidence of what you claim

 

Saunders smartly contrasts his consistent record on trade against Hillary without even mentioning her name. This is the smart way to differentiate yourself from an opponent without directly attacking her.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...e-long-subtweet-of-hillary-clinton/?tid=sm_fb

 

He's committed to running a clean campaign. That alone is enough to confuse the media wonks.

 

http://money.cnn.com/2015/10/26/media/jeb-bush-fox-news/index.html?category=news

Bush is rethinking his media strategy where he seldom appeared on Fox and instead mainly running tv ads. After a $25 million ad blitz in early states last month his poll numbers had hardly moved at all so now he is going to agree to be on Fox every time he can. Before he seemed to be avoiding Fox as a hostile environment or just wanted to control his media image but apparently Bush has realized 80% of Republicans get their news from Fox so he has to bow down and kowtow to the right wing outlet.

 

Kowtow.

 

At what point will Trump's lead in the polls be tested in an actual vote? You'd as well hand the election to Clinton if the GOP proceed with him...

 

Cowbell.

 

Trump is only second in the polls right now with Ben Carson in the lead and he has officially suspended his campaign to sell books. My honest guess is neither one will be the actual nominee and they are just the 2016 version of Not Romney candidates who rose and then fell in the polls.

 

I'm still thinking, hoping and praying that when actual voters go to the polls in Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina and elsewhere they'll think that "while I like Carson and I think Trumps combativeness and attitude is cool, I'll vote for Rubio. He is young, personable and has been in government but not for too long. Besides he's is from Florida and the GOP has got to win Florida"

 

I think that is what will happen. Pragmatism will 'trump' popularity.

But who knows? This has been a bit unpredictable so far.

If Carson and/or Trump win the early primary states, expect a bloodbath at the Republican convention.

 

I'm quite sure that is exactly what will happen. Rubio has a lot of flaws, but he is arguably the best option for the GOP, and I think most people know that, regardless of who they claim to support right now.

 

Of course what everyone ignores is that in regards to Iowa, Trump doesn't have a "ground game" That is thousands of volunteers to go out and help round up thousands of voters to go and participate in the "caucus" . IIRC, the "caucus" is not remotely like going to the polls. It is more like an all day thing (or at least several hours) where you go, join with specific groups and go through several rounds of electioneering and voting. More like a national convention in microcosm.

If you don't have lots of people literally boots on the ground to ride herd over your potential supporters you are screwed.

Of course, arguably only the 1976 Iowa caucuses enabled the winner to get the nomination (Carter).

 

It's definitely more involved than voting, but neither of the two caucuses I've been to lasted much more than an hour. Basically, one round of people declaring their initial preferences by standing in the appropriate corner of the meeting room, then some discussion as the people whose candidates didn't make the threshold tried to decide who to throw their support to (and the candidates that were above the delegate threshold tried to win their support), then another round, then that was it.

 

Hillary wrote an interesting piece to correct some misperceptions and outright lies that her opponents have been spreading.

I enjoy fun. I both have fun and can be fun. Fun is a word that accurately describes me and a large quantity of things of which I am fond. I appreciate fun when I encounter it, and I have even been known to partake in activities that produce fun for myself and others. Fun is something I often have when amongst a group of people. In such situations, I am capable of amusing others and, in turn, of being amused by them.

Thus, I am a fun person.​

More at the link.

I'm not sure the voters will buy it, though.

 

In my opinion on the debate:

Biggest winner:

Marco Rubio- fended off attacks from the moderators and his fellow candidates. Kicked Jeb Bush's ass and the moderators on the EXACT SAME QUESTION

No mistakes or missteps that I could tell.

Other winners:

John Kasich- came out firing and promoting his Ohio record hard- sparred well with Trump. Probably just earned himself the VP nod no matter who is the nominee.

Ted Cruz- tough, combative, and really good on the tax and spending issue. Cool comment about eating a marijuana laced brownie.

No Change

Donald Trump- couldn't really do much more than he has already done. Starting to look weaker I think as time goes on. Lack of ability to explain what he advocates and why hurts him.

Ben Carson- not expected to do much. Didn't do much. Probably no one cares.

Chris Christy- good in debate but didn't prove anything we didn't already know.

Losers

Mike Huckabee- got a decent line or two that no one remembers now. No one cares.

Rand Paul - complete non factor

Carly Fiorino- did herself no favors, does not do well unless someone (like Trump) is attacking her

Biggest loser:

JEB Bush- basically decided to pick a fight with Rubio over an issue (Rubio's voting history in the Senate) that Rubio had just smashed the moderators over just seconds earlier.
JEB might well be immensely smarter than his brother George W. He might be a lot more capable leader. But JEB Bush seems to have no where near the capability of
debating and getting his points across than his less talented brother. It seems that JEB Bush knows his policy positions well but is profoundly uncomfortable talking about them.

 

I didn't even both to watch this episode of clown car.

 

I couldn't find a way to watch this episode, so I'll go with Dayton's reporting. Good to hear Rubio won it, but Kasich has no experience as a VP. Cheney would be a much better choice.

 

On the highlights reel CNN has been showing Rubio looked more like a liar and a clown repeating proven lies about the fake Benghazi "scandal". Yeah, that horse shit sells to the die hard partisan core but no one else believes those lies or cares about them.

 

To those who aren't completely brainwashed, Benghazi is a very serious scandal. Hillary still hasn't turned over months worth of e-mails that, not surprisingly, cover the period when the shit hit the fan. Why would the FBI have to seize her servers several years later to get her e-mails and see if her server had been hacked (it was) if she'd turned over all the correspondence that she shouldn't have even still been in possession of?

 

Biggest fail: ben Carson. By this time token black Herman Cain had already invented a new country and was far more entertaining and likable despite being pre-coz. Come on Mr. Carson step it the fuck up and do a little dance for us. They certainly do not have your black token ass up there to be president. Yeah, we have all heard the vagina is an evil murderer unless white men stop abortions routine, and you are no mike huckabee with your bullshit religion crap. Uncle ruckus it the fuck up or get the fuck off the republican stage stage.

Biggest loser: is still Teddy Cruz who had all of his supporters stolen by donald trump of all people. Then to be denied by the senate and Kim Davis shows he has really sunk lower than low. Really, when you cannot get on stage with a small town kentucky hick in her 15 minutes of fame you are just up there because someone forgot to cross you off the list.

Mitt Romnifeller award of blandness: Jeb Bush of course.

Best token award: Has to go to Rubio. he really seems to think they will let him be president because he speaks spanish the best. They do not want people like him in the country, why the hell would they make one president? At least Jindal was smart enough to say he was tan and had a white picture of him painted.

Biggest business failure: This is a hard one considering there is trump and Icrarly. Both have lost huge amounts of money for their investors, and both can drive really successful companies into the dirt. I have to give it to Icarly though because even she said that she belongs barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen while asking men how to use her own body and mind. Trump inherited his name and failure while she had to work against her own sexist bullshit to run her company into the ground.

The best dayton of the evening: It has to be huckabee. Does anyone like that fucking guy?

 

Is it time we scrap this debate format for something a bit more informative? You do not need a plan on the economy, foreign relations, national security, or any other problem we have. It would actually make your performance worse in these debates to actually get into some long winded explanation of a plan that would address the problem. All these things are is sound bites. Are we evaluating a president or having a presidential version of "Who's line is it anyway?"

If you wanted to have a real debate and really understand the candidates and their idea you would have some long form discussion like this where it would be moderated so the questions would bet organized and the discussion could be threaded for people to read and learn from.

Yes this parade is fun, but I know as much after one of these things as I did before. The only thing that is new and comes out of them is gaffes.

 

This thread amuses me.

Tonight's winners? Trump, Cruz, Rubio.

The rest are in a holding pattern.

Big losers? Jeb Bush and John Kasich. Both will be gone very soon. Bush got bitch-slapped by Rubio. Bush is toast after tonight because the donors if they weren't already in abandon ship mode will be after tonight. Kasich got slapped hard by Trump over the Lehman Brothers thing. Kasich really has no chance anyway. He has no chance of being VP either. I don't think any of the candidates will choose one of the other candidates to be VP unless that person is named Rubio. And that's a longshot. Trump may have the hardest time finding a VP because many will not want to take the ticket with him.

Dayton you've not been paying attention if you think Trump has no ground game in play. It's been reported several times, much to the shock of the people doing the reporters, that Trump is dead serious about running and he has people all over the country working for him. That's not to say he will win in Iowa but he's not going to be steamrolled the way you think he's going to be.

In the end I think it comes down to Rubio, Cruz, Trump and Carson. My money is on Cruz. Literally. First politician I've ever donated money too.

And the moderators? They really should be ashamed of themselves. They were just buffoonish.

 

The outstanding VP candidate is still Nikki Haley. A Rubio/Haley ticket would probably be unbeatable, and would stand in very stark contrast to the elite, white privileged ultra-rich, corrupt, senior-citizens the DNC will have to run.

 

I am pretty sure Bush will be hung in there. I think he will be the Romney of this election. All the others are winning and more popular under the republican umbrella, but it really is not about the republican base in the end. It is really about who can pull independents or get people who do not normally vote out of bed. Whether the dems run bernie or hillary they have a rally. They can rally women and independents with Hillary just for having the first woman president. On the other side you have Bernie who is openly jewish, and he is popular with the middle and poor class. You are not going to outside the system like the socialist jew who is taking no corporate money. The only hope republicans have is Rubio Rallying the hispanics, but in order to do that you have to piss off the Trump voters who are so dumb and stupid they would stay home just to spite the republican party for running a hispanic who they feel is an enemy. Bush is not going to rally many hispanics with his dora the explorer spanish. Not to mention rubio's closet really has not yet been opened. Who knows what is in there. Hillary already has had everything they can throw at her thrown at her. There is no big surprise waiting for her. Bernie seems just too stubborn and rightious to have actually stuck to his words over the years, but he may have some skeletons. Bush is certainly not going to take any minorities from bernie given how he actually listens to them and shows up at their rallies. Bernie might even be weilding a stealth black vote the likes of which we have not seen, even for Obama.

As for Ted Cruz you are on the dead ship already. Cruz burned his bridges with the main party a long time ago, and unless donald actually drops out he will never have control of those voters. Even then I do not think they are going to back cruz because he is a loser over and over and he has that wimpy voice. Trump is probably going to have his chunk of voters which he is going to make a deal for with the republican big wigs, and he is not going to give them up. He is certainly not going to hand them to a loser like cruz. I think that a lot of trump's voters will back victory when the cruz choice actually comes, and he is just going to be swept away like Bobby Jindal. Only cruz will still have his job while Bobby is in for a reconing in his state.

 

Clueless you are......

Bush is toast. There is no hanging in there. He's already lost money to the point that he's stopped paying people. Last night was a final nail in the coffin. The big money donors do not want Trump winning so they will be going to other people. Make no mistake about it. Bush is finished.

Bernie Sanders has no chance. NONE. Hillary, short of being indicted, is the pick of the Democrat Party.

 

Winners and losers according to the Washington Post.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...3rd-republican-presidential-debate/?tid=sm_fb


IMO Rubio was far and away the best on stage. He used every attack the moderators threw and turned them into an advantage. Bush looked really stupid going after him on his attendance when Rubio had just finished hitting that question for a home run.

I think we can put a fork in Jeb. He's almost done. I knew from the beginning he had no chance at winning this but I thought he would at least make it to Super Tuesday. He hasn't stood out at any of these three debates and is now looking desperate trying to attack other candidates. I don't see big donors continuing to give him money no matter how strong those ties are to the Bush family.

 

Tweet from the Weekly Standard:

 

Some of the questions were stupid, which fed into the Republicans lie that the media is one big liberal conspiracy. As a result, serious questions were cast aside. Ben Carson gave a completely incoherent response to Jim Cramer's question about big pharma, for example.

 

This indicates that Trump is in the lead, and has been for some time.

If not one of those, though - who? Cruz?

 

Marco Rubio, though the mainstream press in their rush to not point out that Hillary lied about Benghazi (she told her family that it was a terrorist attack while telling us that it was not) will surely pounce on Rubio's confession that he lies:

Q: #HeyMarco Do you fish? Saltwater or fresh?
A: I fish salt water because I live in south florida. I lie about how big the fish I catch are​

In another exchange he said this:

Q: #HeyMarco Star Wars or Star Trek?
A: Star wars. It has a political theme​

Yeah, and you can't run the country by acting like it has a shuttle craft fairy.