Does Having the Palestinian Flag as Your Avatar Warrant a Ban?

I am not commenting on the possible anti-semitic content of any sig, but I will note that TBBS - which threatened me for a sig that merely alluded to putting another poster on ignore for their political views - is not giving a toss about the sig at the heart of this thread.

No, but she's welcome to bite me if she wants.

TBBS is not a high bar to be setting any sort of standard.

I haven't looked, but I'm guessing the general consensus over there is "Palestinians are the Bajorans, Israel is the Cardassians, Netanyahu is Gul Dukat, Gal Gadot is Damar, Blinken is Weyoun, Biden is the Female Founder" and so on.

Nope, TBBS is pretty much full-square pro-Israel on this one. There are calls for moderation in the Israeli response, sure.

It all comes down to faith, in a sense.

People who look at something in good faith versus people who try to find the absolutely worst faith interpretation of something. Wordforge is where you can say "I love pancakes," and someone will accuse you of hating waffles. Then the thread will break down into why some people hate waffles and Jews, because holy shit this place loves to turn everything into the worst form of anything.

Huh, surprising. Good for them, I guess.

Unrelated: Putin is Gowron, Sisko is Zelenskyy.

You the same person who posted this? Get off your fucking high horse.

"people who try to find the absolutely worst faith interpretation of something" she says, while simultaneously insisting that everyone who disagrees with her is a white supremacist and a Nazi

Yes I am, and I stand by it.

Truth hurts, hon.

The use of "from the river to the sea" has been outlawed in Germany and a protest in Austria was banned for using the slogan. Both countries may have a little experience with antisemitism.

A British MP was removed from the Labour Party for using the slogan.

Buy hey, Wordforge is apparently okay with it.

Something that gets lost (or maybe intentionally ignored) is that the majority of Israeli Jews are Mizrahim. Middle Eastern and North African Jews kicked out of their countries after the establishment of Israel and their descendants.

They don’t have a country to ‘go back to’.

Israel is a Refugee Nation, not a settler one.

It's clear to most of us that you and "the truth" haven't been on speaking terms for several years. But hey, whatever we have to tell ourselves to avoid jumping in front of a bus, right?

To an extent.

I have faith that you - because of your posting history (hey, look FF! We judge everyone on what they say, not just you!) - do not want genocide of the Jewish people or Israel to be destroyed.

Using inflammatory slogans, even if you caveat them, is going to inflame. Why else use them?

Why not have "I support the right of the Palestinian people to seek freedom and an independent state" in your sig?

If you inflame, you can't reasonably bitch about it when you're tied to a stake and the flames are licking your ankles.

You already know the answer to that one.

Yeah, we're revisiting the post 9/11 mindset again. Enjoy the freedom fries, I guess?

Are you suicidal?

No, I don't.

That's why I'm asking someone who I'm prepared to give the benefit of the doubt.

Well....

The part I bolded sure makes it sound like Amaris wants all the Jews out of the land currently known as Israel.

Also, gonna be lazy and just copy/paste a reply of mine from Bluesky:

I appreciate when groups include lengths of time in their posters/messages/signs. “End 50 years of occupation!” Okay! Yeah! Right with you buddy! “End 75 years of occupation!” Okay you can go fuck the fuck off.

https://bsky.app/profile/seasouthern.bsky.social/post/3kekkqspt7m2x

I use "from the River to the Sea" in the same way people used "End Apartheid" during the occupation of South Africa.

That the narrative is to turn it into an anti-Semitic statement is a political maneuver. It is used to neutralize dissent. People don't like to be called anti-Semitic. Who does? So they back down and use softer language. It's like asking people who are protesting why they have to be disruptive, and the answer is because otherwise the protest is ignored. "From the River to the Sea" is a reminder that the people who have been stepped on and pushed aside, corralled into open air concentration camps are still alive, and they're still present in what was their home before the Israeli government annexed it for themselves. It is the slogan of not only Palestinian Muslims, but Palestinian Jews, Palestinian Christians, and others. It is the slogan of Torah Jews, who say "never again," and "not in my name."

For people who are ignorant of everything going on, it seems anti-Semitic, but then people usually only know enough that interests them, and not what affects them. I have strong ties to people who are part of the Palestinian community, part of the Jewish community, and it's why I keep saying that Israel is not Judaism, that Zionism is not Judaism any more than Evangelicalism represents all of Christianity. Zionism is a cult, it is a nationalist belief system, and all the people here thinking this is about anti-Semitism is so grossly ignorant that it's honestly shameful.

Even now, as 17,000+ Palestinians, including 7,000+ children, have been murdered by the IDF with American weapons helping it happen, major organizations around the world are calling this the genocide it is, and yet here we have people arguing over "from the River to the Sea" as a call to genocide. Why? Because it changes the focus from what is happening to what some very sheltered folks think might happen.

Remember land back? The movement that wants to compensate indigenous peoples in the US for land stolen from them by white colonialists? There are dumbass white folks who are absolutely certain "land back" means a call to genocide of white people. It is based in nothing but fearmongering and ignorance. The same applies here. Anyone who thinks "From the River to the Sea" means the genocide of Jewish people is utterly ignorant of what is going on.

I cannot help with that. People are going to believe what they will believe, just like after 9/11 people were attacking Sikhs for looking like Muslims, and who believed every Muslim was a terrorist waiting to happen. I remember during that time I asked for a Qu'ran from the good people at CAIR, and they warned me ahead of time that we lived in an era where possessing a Qu'ran might get me put on various lists, and I'm sure it did. But I wanted to know the truth. I always want the truth, and I will dig for it. Then I reflect on it, and I make it a part of me, so that I can grow and learn from it. I cannot help that there are people who don't get that, who refuse to read, to learn, to understand, and to grow.

So when you say "why don't you say this instead?" I know your intentions are good. I know you really do mean well, but you're asking the same question as "why don't you protest where you're not bothering people?" and the desired result is the same. Why not be less offensive in a matter you believe is life and death?

Again, this is not a genocide

The only people who are calling for one is Hamas and they thankfully lack the ability to carry it out

Israel is literally trying their best to minimize any civilian casualties - which is the exact opposite of genocide - despite Hamas' best efforts to put their own people in harms way

These are the facts

They are not facts, they are suppositions based on incomplete information.

You're wrong

No, I'm not.

https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-rele...ernational-community-prevent-genocide-against

One link, because I know no one here actually reads links because god forbid someone read.

Neat! I'm gonna start using "Jews will not replace us" in the same way people use "good morning," since words apparently mean whatever we want now.

Do you think anything you say or do is going to make the difference in this life and death conflict? You're a terminally online nobody with delusions of grandeur.

Why not just say ‘End Apartheid’ then?

This has serious “I’m just really really into Nordic Runes and Eagles and Red Flags” vibes.

If the majority of the people using a symbol/slogan/flag/whatever use it to symbolize a REALLY BAD concept maybe let them win and pick a new one.

I explained that in my response to @matthunter.

You don't know me beyond what you think I am, and since you don't think but merely react, nothing you say is of any consequence except on this little board where you've dug your home.

1. You're such a smug little prick.

2. The "experts" cited there are repeating Hamas and Palestinian propaganda while intentionally ignoring the context in which the actions they're condemning are occuring. Their criticism is worthless.