Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Rights

Obviously the violation of constitutionally protected rights is of utmost concern, and searches without suspicion/probable cause are unwarranted. This scumbag is trying to dance around that, but as stated in the article, SCOTUS "has invalidated searches premised on consent where it has been shown that consent 'was granted in submission to authority rather than as an understanding and intentional waiver of a constitutional right.'" So his legislation will probably fail once again, or else be ruled unconstitutional if it passes.

Also, this is seemingly another issue like voter ID fraud that lacks any evidence as to being a widespread epidemic which necessitates legislation. Certainly there are some citizens on welfare that abuse drugs, but unless there is evidence that this is a widespread occurrence, drug testing would do more harm than good. Republicans don't really consider the cost of drug testing with these bills. Ultimately, I think drug testing could bankrupt welfare to the point of it no longer being viable. It certainly wouldn't be the first federal program we've seen this happen with. Whether this is an intentional goal of Fincher and other Republicans to systematically dismantle welfare is up for debate.

Finally, we really need to reform our current drug laws. The "War on Drugs" is way more damaging, both economically and socially, than welfare assistance. And ending it would very likely reduce some of the costs to our welfare program in the long term. I'm typically of the "legalize everything" opinion so as to reduce the legal risk and social stigma associated with seeking help from drug addictions.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Not for me.
Seems pretty cut and dry.

Nope, abolish.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

(that's essentially what I meant )

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

When Republicans in Kansas rammed through a similar requirement for testing (although experience in Florida has shown the tests cost far more than the welfare accounts closed as a result of drug use) Democrats sneaked something into the bill which seems appropriate...now all ELECTED OFFICIALS in Kansas must also submit to random drug testing, all the way from the town justice to the Governor.

Elected officials who test positive have to submit to rehab or resign from office. Law enforcement will administer the tests on their chosen schedule. This could get interesting.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

That's awesome.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

I agree with that 100%!

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

I'm surprised it passed with the lawmaker clause. I'm sure they will soon realize the law heaps 4th amendment problems and repeal it.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

I agree with it in principle, but putting it into practice has proven to be expensive and not catch many people.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Well efforts to prevent fraud, insider trading, shoplifting and a host of other things are expensive and don't catch a lot of people. Should we chuck all that out the window as well?

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Florida tried it. It cost more to administer it, than they saved in catching adicts, less than one percent.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Well there you go, then. The rule of thumb is: "If it is expensive, we shouldn't do it."

I propose we abolish welfare. Too expensive. Doesn't actually accomplish very much.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Fuck welfare recipients.

What about the 4th Amendment rights of people who actually work for a living?

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Actually, it accomplishes a lot, namely getting pests out of my hair. This way I don't feel as though I am being double taxed. i already pay taxes. If I have to be charitable, that's like paying two times.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

This is stupid. When Florida passed similar legislation it cost them 4-5 times more to do the drug testing than they saved from kicking off people who tested positive. Guess what? It's a money loser so remember this next time some lying sack of dog shit right winger claims to care about saving the government money.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

On the contrary, Florida's program was a dramatic success at its one and only true goal:

Stealing money from the state is the only thing Rick Scott's ever been any good at.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Ahh, yes, I remember reading about how Rick Scott was still the single largest shareholder in the company which he awarded the no bid contract to do the drug testing. Just another example of Republican corruption, I guess.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

You can't possibly be that brain damaged. We're talking about the difference between a total waste of money which doesn't accomplish anything and things which might be expensive but which do accomplish worth while goals (like not letting infants starve to death). One is expensive but accomplishes a worth while goal while the other just flushes money down the toilet without accomplishing anything at all.

On the contrary, we already know it will cost taxpayers millions in law suits over and above the millions to test people.

I'm conflicted on this, really. And to a large extent, I'm willing to just say "if it saves money, do it, but if it doesn't, don't cling to it out of impractical law-and-order fetishism."

But I actually wonder if this kind of requirement could end up helping people in the long run. There ARE plenty of people with major substance abuse problems, and some of them do get state assistance. Not to say that all people on assistance have a problem, or even most, but some do. And if this provides the incentive that some people need to get clean, that's a good thing.

And, yes, that's a paternalistic outlook. But welfare is sort of paternalistic in the first place.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

IIRC, it was Georgia which tried this back in the late '80s/early '90s. SCOTUS tossed it out on the grounds that it presumed them to be guilty with no evidence.

Well, on the one hand, it seems like it should be no different than drug testing for a job, constitutionally speaking. The employer-employee relationship is different from the government-citizen relationship, even when the government is an employer.

On the other hand, you could argue that it's an undue restriction on the right of the people to elect who they want to.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

A smaller percentage of people on welfare have drug problems than do people not on welfare. Drug testing welfare recipients is a piss poor way to address whatever substance abuse problem you think qualifies as a public health matter.

On the other hand, people not on welfare appear to be doing OK despite whatever drug problems they may have. If you need state assistance, you probably have some problems in your life. Whatever those problems are, shouldn't part of a responsible social welfare program be trying to identify and fix them?

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Most of them are teen mothers. They're on welfare mostly because they got knocked up.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Yeah it is.....

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

While I loath welfare because IMHO it enslaves people to government and in particular to the Democrat party (since they are it's biggest pushers) even I have to acknowledge that some fights just aren't worth it.

I would rather see the money used to drug test these people be put into detecting the other types of fraud that is committed by some welfare users.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

You misunderestimate Volpone and his capacity to suck Republican dicks.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

That's my first thought as well, but it has been demonstrably more expensive.

To be honest, I really don't see how cutting off people from welfare would help them. If drug testing welfare recipients provided substance abuse programs for those who tested positive, yes I could see how that would help. But all this really does is cut them off from their last chance at survival. I really cannot support something that would do that. Any such law would be actively killing off our most impoverished, worst off citizens. To treat them like that would be anti-American.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Now that you bring it up, I'd say that most of the drug addictions RE: welfare recipients would be alcohol and/or tobacco. And preventative medicine is always cheaper and easier than a cure for cirrhosis of the liver or lung cancer.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Yeah, it's not like pregnancy is preventable or anything.

Re: Welfare Drug Testing Bill Reintroduced in Congress, Requires Recipients to Waive Right

Drug testing is fine. And while were at it, program the EBT("food stamp") card to JUST food essentials only. And limit the length iof time that one can collect welfare. Perhaps a year and then a waiting period of five years to re-enroll. Might creat an incentive to TAKING CARE OF YOURSELF!