@Ancalagon: Are you German? @Dr. Krieg: Either that, or a Russian. Or American. How many cases of US aggression have there been around the world since WWII, all on the "defense" budget? -- Cuba -- Vietnam -- Laos -- Cambodia -- El Salvador -- Nicaragua -- Iraq -- Panama ... Plus many examples (Chile, Iran, etc. etc. etc.) on the CIA's budget. So, guys, people who live in glass houses ........
But, but, but.....America!!1! Why don't you regale us with how stronk Russia is, and how much you enjoy carrying water for them?
Because I strive to be even-handed, that's why. Unlike certain people who have this totally square black-and-white, four-legs-good-two-legs-bad view of the world. Which is great if you're too lazy to think.
"I'm not saying Hitler is a nice guy or anything, but what about that British Empire? Isn't it just as bad? Look at what they're doing in India. What gives them the right to criticise?"
Sorry Quest, I just saw this. If you don't mention the poster you're aiming it at, it might not get read. Sooo..... your reductio ad absurdum is very lame indeed. Its purpose, of course, is to muddy the waters and evade the issue. Hitler attacked and invaded all around him, threatening the existence of some very powerful countries. Hitler declared war on the United States fercrissakes. And sure as hell, he got his ass kicked. Annnnnnd, there were No Nukes in them thar days, thus no danger of wiping out civilization permanently. So ---- nice try, Quest. But no cigar. Shit man, you want to get into a fight with a country that will nuke you to smithereens, I'm afraid there's nothing I can do about that. Because that is what will happen. Silly me, I was thinking it was maybe a good idea to look at the world as it really is. But the lemmings are too numerous.
Funny you should say that. I was thinking the exact same thing about Nazi propaganda that detailed the injustices of the British Empire, or Soviet propaganda highlighting American social ills. It's all an attempt to create this murky morass of amorality where everybody's guilty of something. There are a lot of killers, right? So who are we to say one is better than the other? I reject that. One doesn't have to be perfect to oppose evil. And that is what this is about. You may not realize it, but the war has already started, whether we want it or not. Not too many people are going to be able to sit on the sidelines for very long.
Nono has figured out how to do Soviet whataboutism. It is a real thing, look it up, and it was designed to try to deflect from Soviet crimes by changing the subject.
Yeah bla-bla-bla. Do you want to commit suicide? Cuz that's the question. Apparently you and Krieger both do. Keep stuffing words in my mouth like that, sonny, and onto my ignore list you go. If you want to debate with me, keep it honest. If you don't, proceed as you have so far in this thread. You're right: I don't "realize" it. The cliff's just over there Mr Lemming. Better hurry.
I'm old and tired enough to have absolutely no time at all for manichaean one-track "thought" like yours, yeah. Remember, Krieger: four legs good, two legs bad. There's black, and then there's white. No shades of grey. Keep thinking like that and life will pass by reeeeeel easy-like -- no need to cogitate at all.
We don't want to "commit suicide!!1!1÷", we're just not cowards and Kremlin dick suckers, like yourself. It's cute, how you justify Muscovy barbarism, murder and land theft. Russia Stronk, buddy!
This is getting us nowhere. Let's go back to the original purpose of this thread, which is to ask the question: can we trust the American National Security Establishment to tell us the truth about Russin interference in the election? Believe me, I understand why people would have their doubts. The organizations in question have certainly been involved in some shady business over the years. Since the 1990s, they've even become a go-to Hollywood villain in countless movies and TV series. People are used to seeing them as the big baddies. I get it. But since we are, as you say, endeavoring to see the world as it is, we must recognize that the current world order, while not perfect, which is safeguarded in part by the National Security Establishment of the United States, is opposed by an alternative faction who would harness the rising tides of populism, nationalism, and fundamentalism to impose a much more sinister and authoritarian order on the world. When it comes down to it, I trust the CIA et al. more than Putin and Trump.
You need to edit your posts more. You aren't writing for the New Yorker, you're posting on an internet message board to an audience of scifi/politics nerds. As someone who is ideologically similar to you, I can say in all honesty that I can't be bothered to read half of your posts. Brevity is the soul of wit, please exercise it more.
