It would be helpful to include entrepreneurship in high school education - teach kids about the certifications, licenses, organization, planning, etc they'd need to be self-employed instead of having to rely on an employer for a paycheck.
So this thread is going quite nicely, setting up some different debate teams than we usually get. I like this! And true to form, Volpone made the dumbest post of the thread, when he blamed Obama for the current national economy, then credited a man who has been out of office 7 years for the strength of the Massachusetts economy. Sorry, but if Obama owns the failures, then so does Deval Patrick own the success in Massachusetts.
I approve of this product or service and would like to subscribe to your newsletter. Seriously, this would be a great course, along with economics (do they still teach Econ. 101 in high school?), and even one-day "internships" or tours of various workplaces to give kids an idea of what's out there. Boomers realized that unless you've got a Bill Gates mousetrap, you can either follow your heart's desire OR earn a top-tier income. Most of us weren't deluded enough to think we'd have both.
No economics in my high school and the guidance counselors (in both HS and college) didn't seem to be aware of anything out there besides academia and fast food joints. Internships/tours/field trips for young people to learn that there's more to life than scantrons and 5-page papers would probably go a long way to actually preparing kids for adulthood.
I got an MBA. Learned a bunch of cool stuff like how to crank out a methodically researched, comprehensive, and exquisitely prepared marketing plan. You know what there were absolutely no courses on--or available for? Salesmanship. You know the one skill I wish I was better at? You got it. It doesn't matter how wonderful a methodically researched, comprehensive, and exquisitely prepared marketing plan is that you can create, not that many people need a methodically researched, comprehensive, and exquisitely prepared marketing plan. And unless you them that your methodically researched, comprehensive, and exquisitely prepared marketing plan is better than anyone else's, knowing how to make one isn't going to make you one thin dime.
I had a professor in my MBA program who said you can't teach innovation. I suspect the same can be said for salesmanship. When I watch somebody else do it, I can see and understand what they do and why, but I lack the personality to do it myself. I wish this weren't the case, but it's just not me. At any rate, if I ever have an innovative idea (a process that can't be taught), I'll be able to put together an amazing business plan, but the first thing on the to do list is finding a guy to help me sell it (a skill that can't be taught). Fox, you just need to find the right partner. And no, not that kind of partner
I don't know about that kind of thing being impossible to teach/learn. It seems to me that just like public speaking, some people need more practice than others. It's just challenging to get useful salesmanship practice.
I agree. While there are "natural born" sales people, a lot of "salesmanship" can be learned through teaching and practice. I've seen it happen with other people and have experienced it myself.
ugh - being a salesperson sounds worse than cleaning toilets. probably why old folks hated me as a waitress. i could tell you everything on the menu and your food would come out correct and timely and i would smile, but i never could be entertaining and pull out the fake charm...it actually pains me to watch other people do it.
Sales is easy. Doubly so if you actually believe in the product, service, or whatever. Of course, in my opinion, step one is having a genuine like for people and a like of being around people. If you're an introvert in any way, it can be done, but you're going to have an uphill battle.
I have the partner... But for some reason he thinks I need to do the marketing even though he is the one who is really good at it.
Interesting observations. I'd have replied earlier but I hate Swyping on my phone. First of all, I will agree that there are "natural" salesmen and the observation that one needs to have a team and that you can't do everything yourself are dead on. Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak at Apple illustrate those two points. That said, the Marine Corps believes that anyone with a reasonable potential can be turned into a leader. I hold the same is true of salesmanship. No, you probably won't be a Sam Walton or a Zig Ziegler, but you can do it well enough to get by. Which brings me to a related point: While it is useful to have someone on your team who is a natural, everyone needs to know how to "sell." Whether it is yourself in a job interview or your ideas in a meeting or the vendor you want your boss to use. For that matter, telling someone to go attack a fortified machinegun position. Believe it or not, getting someone to go into a situation where death (or at least serious injury) entails a bit of selling. Maybe my definition of "sales" is broad for some, but truth be told, you can't thrive in our culture without knowing how to sell (and having something TO sell). Which brings me around full circle to my last point: Like selling, the Marine Corps believes it can teach leadership. Interestingly enough, like selling, that is ANOTHER thing my Master's of Business Administration didn't teach anything on that is essential to success. So yeah, coming back (at least a bit) to the topic at hand, higher education charges a lot of money for relatively limited value. My school prided itself on the "soft" skills over the technical stuff, but truth be told, I got a lot more out of how to do statistical analysis, create an Excel spreadsheet, take apart a financial statement, and that sort of thing than anything on selling or leading--skills that are arguably more valuable than anything technical they can teach you. Because, as I said on the first day of classes: You can be the smartest person in the world, but if you can't convince anyone your view is the best you're also going to be absolutely miserable as people blunder along around you, ignoring your advice. Sadly I don't think my degree did much to remedy that and I've been forced to supplement it myself.
Yup. In re: what Elwood said, the thing is, extroverts get their energy from being around people. So if you're persuading someone to buy or do something, that energizes them and makes them want to do more of it. Introverts are drained by that kind of activity. So you may make an awesome sale. But instead of that making you want to go out and make another sale, it makes you want to take a nap or read a book or fuck off on the Internet or something.
Aaand I finally got around to opening the link, now that I'm not on a phone. Haven't read a word of it yet but my first snapshot impulse, based on the graphic is why, if you are by definition, average, would you expect to have an income that compares in any way to someone who is 49% smarter, harder working, and more competent than you? [Edit: And having read it, as with any commentary written by a "Mother Jones" author, I want my 5 minutes back.]
Because his guidance counselor told him he was special in his own way, and all his dreams were guaranteed to come true if he studied hard and went to college.
i was born in 79, so maybe I'm too old for this, but I don't remember getting ribbons/gold stars for trying or being told I was special by anyone other than my momma. sure, the classes were easy and everyone passed, but I don't remember trophies for everyone, etc.
I remember getting trophies for everyone, but I think people are deluded if it had a positive effect on our self esteem. If anything getting a trophy for being the last place team in baseball was like a condescending slap in the face.
maybe that's part of it (i'm not completely antisocial, but I am introverted) ...but i think some people just aren't cut out for that kind of job, period. I really dislike having someone pressure me and if someone is pushy in any way (business or personal), my instinct is to retreat. i could 100% believe that the product i was selling was the most amazing thing ever invented, but the first time someone told me they weren't interested, it'd be over because i absolutely hate being pushed and therefore couldn't force myself to do it to someone else.
Here's the hook for sales for me: I am driven to solve problems and help people. That is what motivates me. If I can find a way to help someone and solve their problem(s), that is a "win." But I also need to understand the average person is stupid and skittish and will zig when it is in their best interests to zag. So if I can push someone towards doing something that will actually be in their best interests, that goes in the "W" column for me.
And you also always remember never to let your superior intellect or your disdain for your customer show in your face or your tone.
It's never the ones who don't know things I have a problem with, it's the ones who think dicking about with Dreamweaver and being able to create a SharePoint list in any fucking way qualifies them to tell me how to build their system. Tell me what you want, I'll figure out the how.
Hit the button too soon. That rep was supposed to read "That's why you're not a successful entrepreneur like Volpone."
