Pax Britannia no more. Link- http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/cuts_left_royal_navy_warship_dangerously_unarmed_during_libya_operation_1_3268093 Amazing. This, coupled with the fact that the Type 42 class destroyers have routinely deployed without missiles for the past 5 years, and the new Type 45 destroyers not having any missile system at all because of teething troubles(that wont be ironed out until 2017), doesn't bode well for the Royal Navy. The recent force level cuts by the MoD are foolish, at best, and dangerous to British power projection around the world, and at home. Decommissioning the Ark Royal, accelerating the withdrawl of the Type 22 class frigates, scrapping the Harrier fleet with no viable replacement in sight and the associated loss in capability vis-a-vis the only remaining "carrier"* in service are just the latest manifestation of a decline in capability that has been in motion since the 1966 "white paper" defence review. Unfortunately, I'm not so intimately detailed with Britain's socio-economic situation to present any coherent solutions to the problem. Any thoughts, socio-economic/gun/navyforge? *I put the word carrier in quotations siply because British Invincible class carriers barely qualify as such. They lack steam catapults to launch aircraft, are small in size and are not fully "through deck". A great deal of space at the bow is dedicated to the Sea Dart point defence missile system, taking up valuable deck space. They resemble in looks and capability the Russian Kiev class through deck cruisers more than any contemporary western carrier design.
"It comes after The News revealed the stretched navy was unable to spare a warship to guard British waters for the whole of October following last year’s defence cuts." Why have a Navy then?
If this is true, then it's a damned stupid way to make cuts. However I am always slightly suspect of an article that merely states "sources". Fact is, our socio-economic problems are that we have been borrowing £1 of every £4 spent of our overall national spending. Simply can't keep doing that in a global crisis otherwise we'll end up broke like one of the eurozone countries. So all these routine threads from American posters on how pathetic the British Military is becoming are equally as pathetic as it seems they are posted more to try and troll the board's Brits than they are to actually discuss the reasons why this is happening. The simple fact is that we are not an empire any more, we are a small country that is overspending and is now caught up in global crisis (a crisis started in which country? Hmmm....). Quite simply we cannot keep spending and that means cuts to the military as well as everything else. Quite simply we have no choice.....and it's not as if these cuts reduce us to having a military consisting of one ship, five soldiers and a helicopter, with no nuclear deterrent. The cuts do not leave us defenceless. My only concern lies in the method of cuts, and that includes sectors outside of the military as well, such as welfare benefits and the NHS. For instance, I was talking to someone who works for the benefits agency and they were telling me that the staff members that are being cut are fraud investigation officers. Now what happens during a recession? Fraudulant benefits claims rise. So what genius targetted investogators as the first to go? The problem seems to lie in the way the cuts are made, not the obvious fact that they have to be....and this is probably due to spotty kids with fancy degrees, who have no clue of the real world, being given the task of drawing up cut plans and treating them like they are maths excercises.
I didn't start this thread to troll anyone, I'm honestly interested in an assessment of the situation by someone with more familiarity with English economics and internal political structure, and possible solutions. I'm interested in the UK remaining a major player in international affairs, and having the ability to defend itself, assert itself and be respected in the international community.
The British Military is pathetic. But it's not the fault of the military or the people serving in it. It's the fault of your government. Don't try that nonsense. Everyone was spending like idiots. Eventually it was going to crash. If it wasn't us first someone in Europe would have been the first to fall.
I would like to see that as well, but I am a realist. As long as we remain a nuclear power we will have some influence, but we need to look at the reality of things. In the modern era it's countries with large populations and steady economies that produce big militaries. We simply aren't one of them anymore, irrespetive of our history. I, personally, think that the deconstruction of the Empire with a mistake, both from the point of view of the motherland's benefits and resources, and the benefits of the former colonies, many of which, frankly, would still be better off as British protectorates. But what's done is done, we are now a smaller country and it's really only the combination of our nuclear arsenal and economic strength that makes us anything more than someone like Spain or Italy. Its a case of putting aside what we would like to see and accepting the reality of what is.
Which government? The Major one, the Blair one, the Brown one or the Cameron/Clegg one? So you're saying it wasn't your banks doing all that sub-prime lending? Funny, I thought you were the world's largest economy and all. I must be wrong. It's Luxembourg isn't it?
^^^ Well, I do recall that the economy of Iceland was on the verge of ceasing to exist in 2008. I don't know many people in the US with loans from Icelandic banks so I am guessing a lot of Iceland's economic problems came from... Iceland??? That's just one example. It's kind of hard to pin the whole shebang on the US, no matter how hard you may want to try.
I post on a naval board and we have one person who deployed with the Westminster a d he basically confirmed the story. For obvious reasons he could not report the load out, but made it very clear the crew felt the ship had deployed in an unsafe condition.
