Europe: Learning Them Americans On Statesmanship But Good...

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Ebeneezer Goode, Jun 16, 2015.

  1. Ebeneezer Goode

    Ebeneezer Goode Gobshite

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    Given the European tendency to stick it's pinched nose up towards the US, wafting it's hands like a particularly whiffy fart has hurricaned across the Atlantic, and generally acting like we retired from playing world domination because we'd left it such a pristine state of utopian joy, kind of surprised the current round of EU fuck ups hasn't been waved around more in threads of pure schadenfreude.

    Firstly, we've still not solved the Greek issues. Which is going to blow up in the next two weeks, where one sides blinks or the Euro is going to blow up spectacularly, followed by a prolonged death of many cuts.

    Europe's biggest fear is that outside the Euro, Greece will eventually prosper thus attracting the prospect of other nations leaving. Sure, there's no exit treaty, but a sovereign government doesn't need one - it just needs printing presses and a set of testicles.

    Meanwhile, chances are we're going to water down the sanctions against Russia - likely to be Greece's leaving present, and both Germany and Italy would dearly love to shove the Ukraine under a carpet and normalise relationships with Russia.

    And now we've got the migrants, in the spirit of free movement France has closed it's borders to Italy in an effort to stop them heading in. Italy has responded with threatening to make the whole of the EU pay. Hollande would probably fit concrete boots nicely, and a good chunk of France wouldn't weep if he found himself wading off Sicily in them.

    And finally the UK is getting a referendum - probably just around the time the Spanish party of Podermos is causing further ructions within the EuroZone and in danger of "doing a Greece"

    I really hope you're learning how to run a continent from us...
     
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  2. gul

    gul Revolting Beer Drinker Administrator Formerly Important

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    We talk around the edges of these things now and then, but mostly, we've moved on from paying attention to that train wreck. Initial spectacle gives way to grotesque voyeurism.
     
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  3. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    The Greek government is obviously negotiating in bad faith as evidenced that they keep lying about what the other side said and seems to mostly be concerned with making sure the domestic audience thinks the EU is to blame for Greeks being worthless deadbeats.

    Seriously, no one will lend them more money but their "solution" is to spend more while cutting taxes? Sorry, but you don't have that option, not in the Euro, and everyone will be better off once they get kicked out. Then the Greeks can print their way to high inflation, Greeks can lose their life savings, but finally become economically competitive as Greek workers become cheap enough to be worth hiring.

    They are going to be fucked though because their national debt is all owed in either euros or dollars plus their banks will go bust in the process. No one is going to remember these fucktards as good leaders nor are other countries going to want to follow their lead in the same way.
     
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  4. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    I imagine that they will have ways to make life very difficult for Greece outside the Euro to ensure that it doesn't become a success.

    Their intransigence in negotiations isn't rational except from the point of view that they're making an example, should Spain or Italy be tempted to go down the same road or should populations throughout Europe be tempted to vote for parties similar to Syriza.
     
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  5. El Chup

    El Chup Fuck Trump Deceased Member Git

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    "Europe"? More like the Franco-German meglomania project.
     
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  6. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    Rick failed econ 101.
     
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  7. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    Does Econ 101 teach you to make cuts to spending the midst of a depression and to continue servicing unsustainable debt, or does it teach to dump the debt and devalue the currency? :unsure:
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2015
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  8. gul

    gul Revolting Beer Drinker Administrator Formerly Important

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    The latter, but such options are only valid when we like the country in question.
     
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  9. Liet

    Liet Dr. of Horribleness, Ph.D.

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    On top of that:

    [​IMG]
    Greek spending is already at a low enough level that if the Greek economy were at full employment Greece would have by far and away the largest primary surplus in Europe. Greece has enacted far more austerity than any other European country, is spending at levels that would be ridiculously low even in a well functioning economy, and all it's gotten in return is by far the worst economy in Europe. To continue doing what they've been doing, to even increase austerity, would be to provide a prototypical example of the definition of insanity.
     
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  10. gturner

    gturner Banned

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    A graph of a budget surplus if Greeks had jobs?
     
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  11. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    None of that matters, do you want to know why? THEY DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY, THEY DON'T HAVE ANY CREDIT, NOR CAN THEY PRINT MONEY OR CHANGE MONITORY POLICY IN ANY WAY!

    What is so difficult to understand about that? They are beggers and it doesn't matter if they weren't then they would have money to spend. Offer up a realistic solution or shut up.

    They should never have been allowed in the Euro and their single best solution is to get kicked out. Yes, they will be a clown economy suffering from very high inflation as a result but that is still better than they are now. Even half a decade ago they could have stayed in the Euro, despite their monumental incompetence, if they deregulated everything and eliminated theinimum wage but they were unwilling to do anything intelligent to improve their situation and instead decided to just sit there and demand other people pay their bills.

    It is no wonder the rest of Europe decided Greeks are brain damaged never do wells and cut them off. There is no real danger of contagion now that the emergency fund and measures are in place so throw the worthless shots over board and let them try black mailing someone else.
     
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