Federal Minimum Wage

depends if your heating is radiant or forced air...

Yes, I worked at a couple of places that had those and hate, hate, hated it.

We went to it a few years ago... I don't hate it as much as I thought I would, but that's partly because our building lends itself really well to going off and finding a table in an unoccupied room to work at anytime you want to.

You think that now.

Wait until they can bypass the baby gate and use stools to climb over the bar to get into the kitchen.

She’s already doing pull ups on the gate. It won’t be long now.

I make $17 an hr at my job current. City-wise it's just above the minimum wage of...I wanna say $13 an hr? I honestly don't know because nearly all the positions I've had since leaving the Navy offer at least a dollar to two dollars more than that to get butts in seats.

I can't live in the lap of luxury as a single woman, but I don't starve.

$15 an hr changes nothing for me, but given who I work for, I wouldn't be surprised if they raise wages to keep pay competitive. But I'm not bitter or angry just because other people in other positions get to be paid a living, fair wage. It affects me not at all.

As the cost of living varies wildly between states and localities, I am not sure that it makes sense to have anything but a very low federal minimum.

But is there anywhere in the country where 40 hours per week at the current minimum is a reasonable living wage?

For certain office jobs, it's actually pretty helpful. I agree that it's not for everyone, and not for certain jobs.

As for open concept homes, I think they're great. Before moving into my childhood home, my parents took the time to renovate the kitchen, dining room, and family room so that it was all open, with just a kitchen island and small alcove for the refrigerator to slightly delineate the start of each area. This was well before the open concept craze, and well before HGTV was even a channel. Converting to "open concept" is especially if you buy a house with a tiny/claustrophobic kitchen.

Is radiant heat worse for an open concept? I've only ever experienced forced air heating/cooling in open concept houses, and it works great if you have a good enough HVAC unit. For radiant heat, couldn't you just run more pipes under the floor?

Under what conditions? Having one's own apartment? With a car? With dependents?

A teenager working a fast food job has no trouble living on it if s/he still lives with their parents.

I was thinking more like electric baseboards sucking for radiant. Or old steam systems... but yeah, as they're usually against perimeter walls they're essentially backed by a heat sink


You'd wind up with a couple of issues running extra ducts, not the least of which is cost

you wind up conflicting with the travel of wiring and plumbing, along with getting around the floor joists. optionally you're gonna have bulkheads everywhere

more length or registers equals more volume of air having to be forced through from the source. So either a bigger heating unit or run it hotter anyways to compensate.

At the end of the day, you'd probably get better R value bang for your buck (and less noise) with rockwool between floors.

And in your Murica, that's all they should aspire to, because otherwise they might be going after your job.

What percentage of people working fast food jobs do you imagine are teenagers living with their parents?

The vast majority of employees I see when I go to those restaurants are very clearly adults.

except it isn't just teens working fast food... it's currently 42% of working Americans making less than $15/hr

I make somewhat more than that and wouldn't be able to survive if it weren't for rent controls based on my original rental contract.
and you've seen the entirety of what I live in... about 300 sq ft

You say that like there aren't teens who come from poor families that would have next to nothing if not for that job.

Also, what Spaceturkey said.

What teenager is working 40 hours a week? You realize a lot of different child labor laws prohibit that, and they have to go to school on top of that?

It's perfectly fine for a teenager to make minimum wage and work part time, because they're presumably living at home and focusing on school. They may also be supplementing their family's income. But when someone in their 20s or 30s is working 40+ hours per week at minimum wage, they deserve to be able to live without worrying about paying for food vs. rent vs. heat, you heartless bastard.

Open plan offices are the worst, beyond a certain scale.

At work we are all in one open plan space, and now that we're doing a lot more meetings online it really sucks because there is almost always someone talking on their PC when you're trying to work. Hopefully we move offices soon and can at least space things out a bit.

If "reasonable living wage" means "single person should be able to afford a one-bedroom apartment"...

I took a look at some apartment listings in West Virginia and Mississippi, as those were listed on various things as having lower rent prices. I looked at prices outside of major cities. I found a few in the $400 range, but generally it's going to be about $550.

The recommended rent/income ratio is 30%. So, to be able to reasonably afford $550/mo rent, one would need to make *steps outside Red Room to do math* $22,000/yr, or $10.57/hr.

The lowest I found was $390. So, *nothing to see here no one's doing math move along* $15,600/yr, or $7.50/hr.

No, the current minimum doesn't even provide a "lucked out on cheap rent" wage, let alone a reasonable one.

I’m curious what number our resident market fundy will give you.

Do you think it will be over or under 12% (the actual number)?

Who wants to make a line? Let’s put some money down (it is only fitting).

My argument doesn't turn on the relative quantity of people in that particular case, only that such cases exist. Now factor in people who work minimum wage as a second job, or for extra money, or whose circumstances allow them to accept that wage.

The complete ignorance of economic reality embodied in the belief that a single minimum wage rate will provide a "living wage" (however that's defined) for everyone from New York City to rural Mississippi is staggering.

Wait, before anyone makes a line and starts collecting money I should be clear, when I say 12% I’m talking about the number of people who make minimum who are under 20.

I’m not talking about hours. Only 7% of the the minimum wage hours are worked by teenagers.

So yeah, the line on Paladin’s response should be workers, not hours.

We need make sure we are all betting on the same dipshit response else that’s how fights break out and it’s a Good Friday night so far so let’s not go there.

In my America, teenagers wouldn't--couldn't--settle for a burger flipping job because it pays enough for them to live on their own. But your America is willing to subsidize a lack of ambition and initiative.

My job is in no way threatened by people who will choose to live on minimum wage.

you really need to get some wheels on those goal posts

but you're right. price controls on things like housing need to be addressed as well.

DUDE!

You couldn’t wait a minute on the dipship response so we could have some fun and lay some cash on the line?!?

You’re a lot of fun at parties aren’t you?

If you got "price controls on housing" out of what I said, you didn't actually read it.

Someone invited me to a party once.



Once.

In my travels around this city, I encounter almost no teenagers working fast food jobs. The youngest employees all seem to be in their early 20s. Most look to be in their 30s and older.

The only exception I can think of, possibly, is a pizza place near my house which has some younger-appearing kids working there (one of my daughters actually worked there when she was in high school after she left her first job at Chic-fil-A).

no.. just seems logical given that you'd attempt to counter that inflation would rise with the wage floor

Please wait for me to make an argument before attacking it.

But, yes, that will happen. People at the lower end of the economic scale have a higher propensity to consume than invest. If significant numbers of people who, thanks to an increase in their wages, now can now suddenly live alone rather than with parents of roommates, that will create a higher demand for housing immediately. Since the supply of housing can't change overnight, what do you think will happen with rents?

If your definition of one receiving a "living wage" includes having one's own apartment, then you have to explain how the housing market will adapt to the many new people seeking one.

The median minimum wage worker is 44, female and minority.

We can all come to our own conclusions for why someone like Paladin wants to keep them on the edge of survival and desperate for extra cash.

Yep. There's an implied "right to live alone" inherent in this formulation of a minimum wage. If y'all mean to say that, say so explicitly, and be aware that's another surface that any conservative and a whole lot of moderates will attack if not outright ridicule.