High Speed Rail

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by gturner, Oct 25, 2015.

  1. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    The automakers moved away because Detroit was not competitive. They could get better results cheaper elsewhere. Detroit priced itself out of a job.
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  2. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    The point is, just because businesses are regulated, doesn't mean the business will fail. The auto industry boomed with all the regulation put on it. But greed always wins out. Everyone wins when business is regulated and people are free. What's happening now, and the reason the economy sucks, is because businesses are free and the people are regulated.
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  3. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    The automakers moved away because they successfully lobbied congress to negotiate open trade with third world nations.

    Also ..., not really sure where you're going here. You said earlier we aren't living in a feudalistic society, yet in this statement, you're saying businesses have every right to treat their employees this way. Which one is it?
  4. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    I'm sure most places we build cars aren't third world countries. Chevys don't come from Afghanistan. Buicks don't come from the Sudan.

    But, even so, WHY would they want to leave Detroit? Just to be mean?
    Do you have the right to NOT buy something if you think you can get it cheaper somewhere else?

    That isn't feudalism; that's freedom of choice.

    Feudalism is saying "You, serf, will stay right here and work under the terms that I command."
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  5. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    Why are you being so obtuse? Auto unions and other manufacturing unions made it difficult for executives and stockholders to grab the bulk of the money. Unions ensured the profits were distributed equally among those who owned the company and the stock; and those who generated the labor to create the profits. Therefore, the unions must go.
    That isn't feudalism. Feudalism is "a social system that existed in Europe during the Middle Ages in which people worked and fought for nobles who gave them protection and the use of land in return." Aside from "middle ages", "Europe", and "nobles", can you not see your life going in this direction? If not you, your children and grandchildren?

    Detroit's attempt at privatizing water would have been the first nail in that coffin. Pretty soon, you will be born with a financial debt. You will work your entire life to pay it off.
  6. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    Wrong. What taxes people pay should 100% be part of the public record. It is usually the ones who know they are wrong who try to hide the data, like you are trying to do right now.
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  7. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    This.
  8. T.R

    T.R Don't Care

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    Why? What good comes from knowing how much income your neighbor's make?

    No it's just people who believe in a right to privacy. Knowledge of your neighbor's personal income doesn't help anything except nosy busybodies who think they have a right to pry in everyone's business.
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  9. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    The good comes from knowing what people pay in taxes and who is getting the sweetheart deals only paying 9% like Romney did most years. It means academics can actually do real analysis on tax figures because the data is not hidden so we know ACTUALLY who makes and who pays what versus the porkey pies some tell.

    In any event there is no good reason to hide the data so sunshine really should be allowed in to clean up the rot.
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2015
  10. gturner

    gturner Banned

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    Michigan has 12 automotive assembly plants. The South has 19.

    By state there are:

    3 Alabama
    1 California
    1 Georgia
    3 Illinois
    4 Indiana
    1 Kansas
    4 Kentucky
    12 Michigan
    2 Missouri
    2 Mississippi
    5 Ohio
    2 South Carolina
    3 Tennessee
    2 Texas
  11. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    And yet when you add up the total market value of the automotive industry in California it is #1. Even if you count the value of the items produced in state (meaning not counting retail sales or service) California is #3. There are a shit load of parts suppliers, design studies, and engineering firms here which produce a huge amount of economic value while Alabama remains a dwarf despite having three final assembly plants.
  12. gturner

    gturner Banned

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    California used to have 13 automotive assembly plants. All but one closed.

    They just couldn't fine anyone there that knew anything about cars. :flow:
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  13. Dayton Kitchens

    Dayton Kitchens Banned

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    There is no such economic policy as "trickle down". The term "trickle down" was used to mock the concept that wealthy people invested their money in businesses and industry that ultimately benefited everyone.

    Now, I'm uncertain exactly who people expect to invest in business and industry (except perhaps the government).
  14. T.R

    T.R Don't Care

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    Fixed. Sorry, but mob rule is no longer allowed in most states. If you want people to join your organization you need to accomplish it the same way everyone else does.
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  15. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    http://cleantechnica.com/2015/11/01/china-may-help-finance-california-high-speed-rail/

    It looks like the Chinese State Rail Road Company wants to invest in the L.A. to S.F. section of the route. They already want to invest in a bullet train from L.A. to Las Vegas. So it appears the state is getting the corporate investor they have been looking for. The state's contribution would be $13.2 billion with the Chinese picking up the rest of the tab.

    Hopefully the Chinese insist on moving the route back to the I5.
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  16. mburtonk

    mburtonk mburtonkulous

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    I thought this was news at least a month ago. :unsure:
  17. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    It has been in the works for a while. This is the first time they said they wanted to make it work on the LA to SF route. The Chinese State owned railroad company has also been looking at the LA to LV route as well though that proposed route only gets people to the desert east of LA and not into LA proper.
  18. garamet

    garamet "The whole world is watching."

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    LA to SF makes no sense - there's a dirt-cheap 45-minute Southwest flight almost every hour. LA to LV, OTOH, makes a lot of sense.
  19. Dinner

    Dinner 2012 & 2014 Master Prognosticator

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    It makes a lot of sense if you realize the airports are at capacity yet the number of people who want to make the trip keeps growing. The LA to LV route is really Palmdale to LV. They need to make it all the way to LA but that would be expensive as you have to buy right of ways in one of the most expensive cities in the country. Even if you use freeway right of ways you would have to rebuild a huge number of bridges and roadways.
  20. gul

    gul Revolting Beer Drinker Administrator Formerly Important

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  21. mburtonk

    mburtonk mburtonkulous

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  22. NAHTMMM

    NAHTMMM Perpetually sondering

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    It wasn't simple lack of knowledge so much as all the cars that California built had a habit of colliding, or flying off of winding mountain roads, and exploding spectacularly.
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