Microsoft reverses all their DRM policies

The XBOX 180.

Wow.

I was thinking of getting a next-gen game machine and it seemed like the PS4 was going to win by default. This puts XBOX One back into contention.

PC gaming master race checking in. You're all a bunch of n00b casuals.

That is all.

Hmmm...no...

This is like when you go to spank a kid, and he screams "wait a minute! Wait a minute! I'll clean my room now!".

Nope, too late, the spanking has to go through, or the threat means nothing.

Nobody still buy an Xbox.
Ruin their Christmas.

If you don't follow through on the spanking this console generation, they don't learn.

PC are the Elite European Aristocrats of gaming. I have a 64 bit Windows 8 OS, ahlon quad core 3.6 gz. The video card is a superclock evga nvidia 660 ti with 3 gig of video ram. I have 8 gig system ram and 1 2 terabyte drive, 1 1 terabyte drive. I can run all game graphic effects on ultra.

Mandatory Always on camera and mic still there? No sale.

Really? It's unclear?

Here, lemme give you a hint...

Really?

I don't know how much of a gamer you are, but I game quite a lot and I know that eventually, I'll probably own both a PS4 and an XB1... but if I were only going to buy 1 console, it'd be the PS4. Microsoft has shown that they have other aspirations in mind and I just don't know how dedicated Microsoft will be to the gaming market in the next 5-10 years. Sony has been in gaming since 1995 and they've demonstrated their commitment to gaming by buying/developing 12 wholly owned game studios and investing heavily in game tech and hardware development.

JMHO, but PS4 will be first for me and XB1 later... after possibly a price cut.

I'll probably stay with Sony (I had a PS2 and now have a PS3, never had an XBox) but I like to check out new stuff as it arrives.

Paladin, one day youlll have to try the mass effect games there like a HBO star trek series.

They didn't hear YOU. They heard the sound of your wallet closing.

Why the selection of games for the PS4 might be much than that for the XBox.

More at the link.

Microsoft really had no choice but to fold after last week's debacle.

What they should have done was promise consumers dramatically lower prices on new games, since they were about to destroy the used games market. And they should have emphasized more that players were going to get discounts on new games for "selling back" their unwanted digital copies.

The DRM changes may have been largely a power play against consumers, as they have mostly been received, but there was potential to evolve the market into something better. Consumers may regret favoring the status quo as it encourages the industry not to innovate.

Meh. The only way you'd see those kinds of things is if MS gets clobbered in the market by the PS4. Or, if Nintendo realizes that their goose is cooked.

I really don't understand what it is about the used game market that M$ is so keen to see the downfall of.

I mean, games seem to make the most money in the first few weeks of release. Assuming a game sells for $60 in the first, say, 3 months, the same used game during that time might be sold for $55, which to most people, they would rather just shell out the extra $5 to get the brand new packaging, virgin instruction booklet, etc. Plus, during this time, most people are playing their new game and wouldn't sell it just yet.

Another thing I'm not understanding is, when a new game is released, don't retailers like EBGames, Wal*Mart, etc. decide how many games they are gonna buy, then re-sell it to the customer? If that's the case, then haven't the publishers already made their money? If a store bought 100 games of X-Com, and only 25 sold, haven't they already paid for the remaining 75 and are stuck with them? This would make no difference to the publisher. The only time it might make a difference is if all 100 sold out and people are swapping them before the store gets their next shipment, and how often does that happen with a major release?

It seems to me the anti-used game policy M$ tried to implement was fighting what amounted to scraps - to squeeze every last penny out of the consumer. I hear a lot of people on the internet saying they aren't going to get an XB1 just to spite Microsoft now.

Publishers are just being greedy and they see the second hand market as lost profits. In their ideal world we'd have to pay a fee every single time we want to play a game.

I don't mind publishers and studios getting a cut of second hand games profits. The fact is that there is no other type of software you can buy that would allow a second hand market that cuts the developers and publishers out of the profit loop. The fact is that when you sell a used game, you don't get much back from GameStop and they don't discount much when they sell a used game to you. In other words, you get fucked coming and going. I'd rather support the people that made the software that I like so much.

I didn't mind used game policy if the XB1 as much as I did their always on/Kinect only policy.

I would think the best way to go about it is to treat physical media as it was before: no online DRM, can be freely traded, no region locks, etc.

On the other hand, you have an alternate digital download. The program is permanently tied to your account and it goes for cheaper and there can be sales to make it even cheaper. Players late to the game would be more likely to buy an older game if it goes on sale in addition to the newest releases.

The end game is maximization of profits for developers by cutting out the middlemen and gamers who are would have more access to games because they're cheaper.

I couldn't agree more. If publishers really want to discourage used game sales, do something like sell the game 2 weeks early as a digital download for $40-$50. If you want to wait for a retail disc that can be sold, then it's $60. I'd download everything.

Unlike say, MS Office or Photoshop, a video game is an entertainment medium. How would you feel if the movie studios tried to do the same thing with used DVDs? Or book publishers and used books? One doesn't have to sell a used game to Game Stop, they can sell it on eBay, to their friends, to a comic book shop (assuming there's one still in business near them) that handles used items, or a pawn shop. Pretty the same is true of books.

Unless the movie is direct to DVD, it is in a secondary market, the primary one being the box office. Then there's streaming sources like Netflix, VUDU and cable TV which pay royalties. The point is that there are several streams of revenue for movies that video games don't enjoy. Which is why I made the proposal I did in post #23.

You're forgetting that many games now have licensed merchandise, movies, and TV shows based off of them, as well as virtual items within the game that can be purchased for real money. Additionally, until recently, no game had a production cost as high as a major motion picture.

Would loved to have had Microsoft stick with a Steam type distribution and re-selling of games eco-system they were working towards, and the family and friends lending system they were putting in place (which I thought was a really good idea). It would have been a boon to people to be able to share games digitally.

I actually prefer to buy my games digitally if I can. Having a disc doesn't mean all that much to me in most cases. Rarely, if ever, do I trade games in fast enough or get enough money back to even care. But it would have been nice to share the digital purchases.

However, the downfall of it was the disc portion needing to constantly be validated through their servers. As Ramen said, they should have tried to just do the best of both worlds, sticking somewhat with the past and also innovating digital game distribution for consoles. Hopefully we'll still see some improvements in this area, instead of more stagnation by both MS and Sony.

Ok, I get that you guys like digital games, and so do I. Nothing beats having Final Fantasy XI to IX on my PS Vita and the ability to re-download them if for some reason, my Vita becomes bricked.

But I really, really, REALLY miss the little booklet filled with art, quotes, profiles, and all the other good stuff that came along with the CD case. It's really the only reason I prefer the physical copy to the digital, and I'm not even talking about special editions.

Those pre-order cards you get from the game shops SHOULD include this. How great would it be if you went into Gamestop and when you bought the game, it came with an instruction book and within this book contained all the stuff I listed above, as well as the code you would enter into your XBox Live or Playstation Store account to have it downloaded onto your game system?

I tell you, if everything goes digital there is a HUGE market for collectable items like artbooks, soundtracks, statues, keychains, etc. etc. that N.America hasn't even begun to realize yet.

Those can be great. Done right they can set the tone and get your juices flowing before you even start playing.