As for me... Young? Not really. Never needed surgery but I do need expensive medication for a chronic condition that medical science hasn't gotten a handle on. I look at where innovation happens and believe in rewards for same. I also realize that socialized medicine is NOT going to make a real fix for my condition happen any faster than the bastardized system we have now. The fixes our healthcare system needs are NOT being addressed in the reform the Obamessiah and the Dems are pushing. (Being allowed to buy insurance from out-of-state, for instance,would be part of a package of fixes. Competition among insurance companies would help pricing, availability, and coverage.) If they were, I'd be a lot more interested. Believe me. I've got a vested interest in having some help. Obamacare is NOT about fixing the problems. It's a powergrab, pure and simple. You also keep beating the drum about employers paying for health insurance. That's crap. I'm paying. I'm not cutting the check and mailing it to them but it's part of my compensation. The company offered it to me to get me to come work for them and it makes sure they keep the package competitive to keep me. In return, I keep working well for them. Wait times, in the short term, do have a lot to do with the ratio of providers to patients in a particular area. But, in the long term, the number of providers has more to do with how attractive the job is. If more people see the benefit of becoming doctors (more money, perks, etc.) then they will. The president's overall package of power grabs penalizes people for becoming doctors as surely as the lack of tort reform (another key idea missing in this monstrosity) does by increasing taxes on the wealthy. Did I miss anything in your biased rant?
If it was simple pandering, they would be truly interested in fixing the actual problems, Axiom. Pandering would mean they wanted to make their customers happy. They've got no interest in actually helping us out here. Or, at least, they're WAY more interested in expanding their own power than they are in really helping the taxpayer out. And, before you say it again, this level of powergrab hasn't been done before. Except, possibly, by Johnson and the Democrats or Roosevelt and the Democrats. Hmmm. Seems to be a pattern here in who wants to unconstitutionally expand the feral gubmint, doesn't there?
You fail to understand. Bock fears that it's good policy and that good policy will make the Democrats more popular and powerful. A lot of the Republican hysteria makes a lot more sense looked at through this slightly absurd lens. Anyway, Bock needn't fear. To whatever extent this reform effort is good policy--I'd call it reasonable policy but a much more incremental change than advertised and needed, and a policy that might completely backfire if the Republicans gain control of the House or Senate and futz around with it before most of it takes effect in 2014; call it a 2 on a scale of current policy to 10--the Democrats are far too inept to take political advantage of it.
No. I don't "fear" it as good policy. I fear it as bad policy and I gave my reasons for it. You, on the other hand, gave no refutation of my points. As usual.
They are pandering, but they're just not backing it up with anything. We see it all the time on both sides of the political fence. Look at abortion laws. George W. pandered to the anti-abortion crowd and convinced many of them that Roe vs. Wade was about to become a big issue again, but nothing changed. W. probably knew what he was going to do in advance, and this was no different. Politicians pander to people all the time. Sometimes they tell them what they think they want. Other times, they plant the seed for what the people should want and then come in to "deliver the goods". It's an old play that people fall for to this day, again, on both sides of the aisle. Well, keep in mind the reason why Democrats exist. They want to be the great equalizers, and I think that works in their favor on civil levels, and very much against them when it comes to fiscal solvency. The problem for many Republican Conservative/Libertarian politicians is that some want to go too far in one direction, while at the same time many Liberal/Democratic politicians have the issue where some want to go too far in the other direction. Then it comes down to vote getting, and a politician will promise you the moon if it means you'll vote for him/her. You aren't getting it, but they'll keep filling your head with guarantees right up until you check the box. Most powergrabs are subtle. Some are overt. Some happen with the Will of the People, and others happen for "our own good". The point is, that the government will continue to consolidate more power, toward either extreme, and unless we find some sensible representatives who realize that no one way is 100% correct, and vote them into office, we're pretty much screwed. I have doubts about this health care plan. I understand people need health care coverage, hell I'm one of them, but whatever gets pushed through, I want it to be as sensible, light, and reasonable as possible. Simply pushing through something for the sake of getting it through smacks of desperation. It's the same thing that people would have called George W. on, and Congress needs to be called on it here. Don't pass it for the sake of passing it, pass it because it will be a great benefit to Americans in need and the American tax payer. Such a system CAN exist. There are many great options between "Let them die in the streets" and "Cover them from birth to death for free".
What Tamar said. Somebody better do some explaining right quick or there's a vacation in your near future.
Well, not really hear to debate the definition of pandering or whether politicians of both parties seek to expand the power of government. People of all stripes work to make themselves and their jobs more important and indispensable. Right? I will say it again, though, that this level of that type of thing has not been done before. I agree with you that both the current major parties have their problems but there is a clear, very clear, difference this time. And, that difference has existed for quite a long time. This past year, though, has far surpassed even the historical levels of buying votes and attempting to increase gubmint control. From takeover of financial institutions to takeover of corporations to this latest attempt to control an entire sector of the economy, IT'S DIFFERENT this time. I am several years older than you and still a Christian. I say both those things to say that I've seen the Reps do exactly what you're talking about to me and a lot of people that I know. I agree. Politicians will take advantage of you and promise you things to keep and expand their power. So? What are you going to do about it? Are you going to turn to distrust of the whole lot of them and outright skepticism of any of them who want to grab more power? (Hint, in this case, that's the Dems and Obamacare.) That's what I did here and I proposed an alternative based on some basic ideas. And, yes, I did happen to hear some of those from conservative sources. Maybe next time it'll be a different philosophy. Maybe not because, historically, I haven't seen this type of limited government proposal ever coming from a liberal. Just today, I was trying to explain some of these feelings and thoughts to my daughter while we were watching the news. It was probably the first time I'd ever actually said out loud that we needed to vote every last one of them out and start completely over. I've got the bad feeling that they're all so addicted to power (even in some slight way) that we'd be better off with someone brand new. Some of that is quite true. And, as I said in a previous post, I don't see the current plan as doing anything to fix the real problems. It's more of a power grab than a solution to the problems.
^ Yeah, I'm not up for debating pandering either, let's just leave it at politicians making more promises than a Zucker/Abraham/Zucker film makes jokes, hoping some hit the wall and work in their favor. As for the health care plan, that's why I don't like the mentality of "we'll push it through no matter what!" or "we'll reject it no matter what!". There are way too many uncertainties. I don't doubt many Congressmen speak out of real concern (Dems and Pubs), but shoving a half baked plan through helps no one, just like zero tolerance helps no one.
Healthcare in the U.S. is an uneven slippery slope that's hard to fix & get right. U.S. healthcare itself is sick, critical & needs to be ambulanced to the ER pronto. There's only one catch: it has no coverage.
And you think Obama doesn't have a chubby for your tax dollars too? Socialism is neither cheap nor free.
Your healthcare isn't fine. Too much government regulation in a system that is meant to be 'private' in a sense causes all kinds of fuckups. But what Congress is trying to do is only going to make it worse.
So why are you still in Canada, then? Its a far more socialist country than the US. Why not come here?
Canada is only socialist in the sense that our health care is run by the government. Yet, even there each province is responsible for its own system. There is just one central 'law' that they must adhere too. You'll find that with a lot of our policies. We have a WAY more decentralized system than you do. I like our government, I even at times like the opposition and what they bring to the table. I do NOT like our health care system, but I'm not the only one and I think the way we provide health care will change in the future. I like the way the provinces are allowed to look after a lot of things, and I will keep voting for a platform that pushes to have even more power given to the provinces. Also, Alberta is a VERY good place to run a small business. Not a huge amount of corporate taxes for a small business. In fact from the research I've done there are next to done. And since my future plan is to own my own business, why would I go anywhere else? Small businesses are flocking to Alberta because of our freedom and beneficial tax structure. Even our federal government is tweeking with the tax code each year to provide more incentives for outside investment into small businesses and startups, as well as making it easier for someone to start a business and not get run down by government regulation. All in all it makes for one hell of a place to find financial prosperity. Oh, did I mention that our government officials aren't a bunch of loons? Well, outside of Jack Layton that is. But he is a small minority that represents a part of Canada. I respect that and hope they continue doing what they do. It makes for more equal respresentation.
Really, because to hear our folks tell it, you guys subsidize all kinds of businesses that the US doesn't. Come to think of it, I think even you mentioned getting gubmit subsidies for a wind turbine which until very recently the US didn't offer. How's that not socialism? Sadly, we can't even have that kind of discussion, since any talk of a "national standard" is met with cries of "SOCIALISM!!!!!" Yeah, we Americans, what with our national IDs, single national identity, etc. We're so much the same that none of us could ever embrace the idea of balkanization. Nope. Good luck with that. In which case, if its so great, why do you fap on about America, then? Those "incentives" wouldn't happen to be subsidies would they? Because that's "SOCIALISM!!!!!!" You know, the funny thing is, most Americans don't consider their politicians to be a bunch of loons, either. They might not like many of them, but few of them would ever call their elected officials out and out batshit crazy. Which is a shame, because many of them are, and I'd be willing to bet that if people poked around Canadian politics, they could find the same ratio of Canuck pols saying totally bizarre shit to those who say intelligent shit, as you find here in the US.
It's funny that the medical system in the US which gets the highest customer satisfaction ratings is the evil, socialist, government run, single payer, VA. Think on that one for a while.
How 'bout zero tolerance of this half-baked plan? Just shoving something through with the clearly stated goal of "fixing it later" is NOT my idea of hope and change. We've had far too much of that already.
The problem is not the quality of American healthcare. The problem is accessibility and affordability.
Government grants make a country socialist? The US has been giving billions of dollars worth of grants for years. In fact, every single government in the world gives out government grants. You're just trying to reach for stupid shit here. You can't have that kind of discussion because your government leaders aren't interested in it. Obama and the Democrats, as well as the Republicans want MORE federal power. Again, more stupid, pathetic and ridiculous comments that have absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand. Because I'm an American and I voted last time around? And more stupid comments that just show you're not interested in actually having a serious discussion. The incentives basically revolve around not as much regulation in regards to outside investment, and a beneficial tax code to encourage people to start a small business.
^By far we have more loons. Even on a per capita basis. but tax rates aren't what you might guess US taxpayers in general pay a LOT more than most other countries to subsidize breeding a future round of more taxpayers and leeches. And is it any wonder why asian countries have been catching up on europe like its standin still (on wealth and quality of living metrics)?
