Tex's DS9 reviews: In the Pale Moonlight

Discussion in 'Media Central' started by Tex, Jan 23, 2007.

  1. Tex

    Tex Forge or die. Administrator Formerly Important

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2005
    Messages:
    17,627
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Ratings:
    +117,364
    Rating: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos: :tos:

    I just caught the last 5 minutes of this episode... it is one of the best ever made in any of the Trek series.

    Sisko having to keep everything on his shoulders makes this one great. I think it earns it's 10/10 rating in the last monologue when he says "I can live with, I can live with it. I can live with it?"

    [​IMG]

    We also got the classic "IT'S A FAKKKKE" scene and some heavy involvement from my favorite character, Garek. What's not to love?

    [​IMG]

    To save time I'll post the wiki version of this episode for any of you that have lived under a rock and don't know it.



    Discuss.
    • Agree Agree x 5
  2. garamet

    garamet "The whole world is watching."

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    59,487
    Ratings:
    +48,917
    Easily my favorite DS9 episode, and DS9 is my second-favorite Trek. :techman:
  3. evenflow

    evenflow Lofty Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    25,051
    Location:
    Where the skies are not cloudy all day
    Ratings:
    +20,614
    :techman:
    • Agree Agree x 2
  4. Marso

    Marso High speed, low drag.

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    29,417
    Location:
    Idaho
    Ratings:
    +14,151
    This was a good episode, but it just didn't make the impact on me that it seemed to on everyone else. Part of the problem for me was that Sisko seemed totally and completely off-character.

    Okay, hit me with the flamethrower now. I've got on my million power sunblock. :elwood:
  5. Aurora

    Aurora Vincerò!

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2004
    Messages:
    27,169
    Location:
    Storage B
    Ratings:
    +9,325
    This one gets no :cass: rating. It gets one :j: out of one possible :)
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Tex

    Tex Forge or die. Administrator Formerly Important

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2005
    Messages:
    17,627
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Ratings:
    +117,364
    The one issue I do kind of have with the episode is that I totally believe the end justifies the means. I wouldn't have had Sisko's moral dilema with killing the guy that made the data rod or the Senator. It comes down to a few lives versus billions... and the few lives were lives of what would be considered by most to be "bad guys."
  7. Marso

    Marso High speed, low drag.

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    29,417
    Location:
    Idaho
    Ratings:
    +14,151
    You're just a 21st Century Man. :techman:
    • Agree Agree x 2
  8. Ash

    Ash how 'bout a kiss?

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,748
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Ratings:
    +3,656
    This was the episode that really sealed DS-9 in as my favorite Trek ever.
  9. evenflow

    evenflow Lofty Administrator

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    25,051
    Location:
    Where the skies are not cloudy all day
    Ratings:
    +20,614
    To me it was Sisko unbound, one of the few times we really got to see how cold and Machiavellian he could be, instead of just hinting about it. Added onto the always superb Garak, that pretty much did it for me.
  10. Dayton Kitchens

    Dayton Kitchens Banned

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Messages:
    51,920
    Location:
    Norphlet, Arkansas
    Ratings:
    +5,412
    One thing I liked was the Romulan Senator actually detailing why the Federation is losing the war. We were seldom given real underlying reasons for the Federations poor performance.

    Romulan to Sisko:

    "The Dominion shipyards are operating at full capacity. Yours are still being rebuilt"

    "The Dominion is breeding legions of Jem'hadar warriors. You are experiencing a manpower shortage".

    "And finally, the Dominion is committed to fight this war to the finish. It's no secret that the Federation has been considering a peace offer"

    Or something along those lines.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. $corp

    $corp Dirty Old Chinaman

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    15,867
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta
    Ratings:
    +7,101
    One of my favorites, out of a long list of favorites. I think I like "The Visitor" more as a stand alone episode, but of all the war episodes, this one takes the prize.

    The Romulans joining the war was one of the BIG developments of the ongoing story arc. Really funny how DS9 could have such a turning point in the war without having to use millions of dollars in special effects...like some other shows.
    :garamet:
  12. Shirogayne

    Shirogayne Gay™ Formerly Important

    Joined:
    May 17, 2005
    Messages:
    42,379
    Location:
    San Diego
    Ratings:
    +56,133
    FLAMEZ OMG!!!!! :soma:

    But seriously, I think that's why people love this so much. Sisko makes the hard choice--one that none of the Trek captains, save maybe Archer in season three, have ever done. Perhaps it's not entirely in character, but no one's a robot and no one plays by the rules all the time.

    He had to choose between the needs of the many versus the needs of the few. Can't say I wouldn't have made the same choice. :clyde:
  13. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    25,217
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +21,463
    I found it odd that Starfleet Command signing off on Sisko's plan didn't seem to make much of a difference, either to me or to Sisko.
  14. marathon

    marathon Calm Down, Europe...

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    28,685
    Location:
    Midamerica
    Ratings:
    +3,593
    Liar! It was actually Profit and Lace, admit it :soholy: ;)
  15. marathon

    marathon Calm Down, Europe...

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    28,685
    Location:
    Midamerica
    Ratings:
    +3,593
    Are we sure he didn't actually speak to a Section 31 official? :flow:
  16. $corp

    $corp Dirty Old Chinaman

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    15,867
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta
    Ratings:
    +7,101
    Starfleet signing off on Sisko faking the evidence to bring the Romulans into the war, NOT Sisko killing a Romulan senator and making it look like the Dominion did it.

    If the plan failed, they could probably blame Sisko as being one captain that let the war push him over the edge and felt he had to act alone to stop the war in any way possible. I could see Starfleet hanging him out to dry if Vreenik was able to bring that data rod back to Romulus. Sisko would have been the laughing stock, not Starfleet. At least, that's how Starfleet would have painted it.
  17. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    25,217
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +21,463
    But Sisko didn't kill the Romulan, Garak did. And if the various Admirals are as cunning and paranoid as they all seem, they surely must have realized that Sisko or someone near him might have had to kill Vreenak to make it work.
  18. $corp

    $corp Dirty Old Chinaman

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Messages:
    15,867
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta
    Ratings:
    +7,101
    That what I said. There is no way Starfleet would have signed off on the plan if it involved the death of a Romulan senator. Starfleet only signed off on them faking the evidence of the Dominion invading Romulan space.

    I'm convinced that if Sisko's little "fake" had been brought back to Romulus, Starfleet would have no problem hanging Sisko out to dry on it. (ANd washed their hands of the whole situation.) Luckily, Garak had a suspicion the plan wouldn't work, and already knew the moment Vreenak landed on DS9, he wouldn't be making it back to Romulus.
  19. Order2Chaos

    Order2Chaos Ultimate... Immortal Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2004
    Messages:
    25,217
    Location:
    here there be dragons
    Ratings:
    +21,463
    Right but I think the admiralty were thinking exactly the same way Garak was, and only signed off on the plan because they knew it would either work outright, or through the death of Vreenak. You're probably right that they would have hung Sisko out to try if he was dumb enough to get caught with no one like Garak to help out, but I don't think they expected to have to do that whether or not the plan worked.