Theological discussion.

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Diacanu, Sep 15, 2023.

  1. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    Reconcile Jesus being a pacifist with Republicans being gun nuts.
    Aaaand go!!

    :corn:
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  2. Tererune

    Tererune Troll princess and Magical Girl

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    one word explains it all. It might not be the explanation you want, but it is the explanation youi can see.


    Trump.
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  3. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    Jesus was not a pacifist.
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  4. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    Jesus was not a pacifist because he didn't exist.
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  5. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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  6. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    So "turn the other cheek" was a cute ironic suggestion?
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  7. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Just in time for the Halloween season.
    IMG_3278.gif
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  8. 14thDoctor

    14thDoctor Oi

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    He probably said that when he wasn't busy flipping over tables and chasing people around with whips. :async:

    But also:
    “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and one’s foes will be members of one’s own household” (Matthew 10:34-36).
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  9. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Yeah but that's about Trump.

    Or Brexit for us lot.
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  10. Uncle Albert

    Uncle Albert Part beard. Part machine.

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    Jesus built my hot rod.



    :nana:
  11. Rincewiend

    Rincewiend 21st Century Digital Boy

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  12. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    It's fairly clear from textual analysis that it's an invention of the gospel writers. The pacificistic parts were add-ons to mollify the Romans as the new religion grew.
  13. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    I mean, it's pretty much all an invention by the writers.
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  14. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    I suppose that depends on one's beliefs about the Bible.

    I believe that a specific man existed 2000 years ago.
    I believe he had a charismatic personality and convinced many people to listen to him.
    I believe that man was schizophrenic.
    I believe the writings that led to a religion that became Christianity is based on the ramblings of a crazy person.
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  15. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    There are good arguments that it isn't. That's not to give credence to the supernatural elements, just to there being real historical events behind the stories.
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  16. Thoughts and Prayers

    Thoughts and Prayers Fresh Meat

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    He may have been a peaceful itinerant preacher 2000 years ago, but when He comes again it will be at the head of a zombie army the likes of which the world has never seen!

    Of course, He could also appear as a giant Slor! Many libs and homos will know what it's like to be roasted in the depths of a giant Slor that day, I can tell you. He'll make the universe great again!
  17. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    But the stories aren't firsthand accounts, they were recorded after the fact once certain historical events occurred. Is a story necessarily true just because certain historical events took place in the story or with certain historical people? Shouldn't we require some other extrinsic evidence or firsthand accounts?
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  18. Thoughts and Prayers

    Thoughts and Prayers Fresh Meat

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    Our knowledge of antiquity is chock full of conjecture. There's really no reason to think a Jesus-type figure didn't exist. There's plenty of reason to believe he didn't perform cool miracles and no-sell death, though.
  19. Dr. Krieg

    Dr. Krieg Stay at Home Astronaut. Administrator Overlord

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    It cannot be done.
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  20. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    That's not a reason to believe something or someone existed. There should be reason to believe he existed, and there is nothing reasonable to suggest he did by historical standards.
  21. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    Multiple independent sources say he existed. That's more than we require for other historical persons.
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  22. Fisherman's Worf

    Fisherman's Worf I am the Seaman, I am the Walrus, Qu-Qu-Qapla'!

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    Each contradictory to varying degrees, and each recorded one to three generations after the purported existence of Jesus.
  23. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    There are contradictory reports in yesterday's newspapers. It doesn't mean that they're total invention.
  24. Spaceturkey

    Spaceturkey i can see my house

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    yesterday's newspapers are multiple sources... stories decades (or even centuries) after the "fact" are fan fic.
  25. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    Well, this went about where I thought it would.
    The real answer to the contradicting Jesus, is the whole "creating God in your image" thing.

    Everyone has....their own...personal....Jesus!

  26. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    Nah, this mentality goes back to the 80's or so. Trump just gave them a permission structure to flaunt it (and also, Trumper/reactionaries/christianists are not actually as interested in theological rationalization as their parents. Most of them don't even go to church.

    My thesis is that they don't think of Christ as a pacifist and never really did. They're not only frustrated confederates but frustrated Crusaders.

    EDIT to add:
    The entire manipulation of religion (and to a larger extent the art of propaganda generally) finds it's greatest power in developining a victim mentality.

    "THEY" are coming for you, to oppress you, to steal your children, to enslave or even kill you - THEY must be stopped. The Others should make you angry and afraid, follow us and we will lead you to overcome THEM.

    Being armed and spoiling for a fight is a fellow traveler with being indoctrinated into this mentality your whole life.
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2023
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  27. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    When there's a Cash version - always choose the Cash version.

    Johnny Cash - Personal Jesus with LYRICS HD - YouTube
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  28. Nova

    Nova livin on the edge of the ledge Writer

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    this whole "Jesus was"/"Jesus wasn't" discussion, while fascinating, is slightly off the topic established in the OP.

    What's relevant to Gun Culture is what THOSE people THINK Jesus was.

    Whether he was a pacifist or not isn't the point - THEY don't THINK that he was.
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  29. Thoughts and Prayers

    Thoughts and Prayers Fresh Meat

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    Well, we all know the shortest Bible verse:

    "Jesus reloaded."
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  30. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    Hmm …
    Jesus flipped the tables of the tax collectors. Tax collectors were people who took everything from The People. Jesus fought for The People by flipping tables because gun power and projectile weapons weren’t as accessible by The People as they are now. If Jesus were here today, he’d use guns to take back what those damn communist, money collecting, liberals took from The People.
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