Throw Aziz Ansari on the pile

https://www.avclub.com/aziz-ansari-is-now-facing-allegations-of-sexual-miscond-1822070857

Looks like Aziz was wearing too much Dennis Feinstein. Is being pushy a form of sexual assault? Is a celebrity/starfucker relationship a power imbalance? I report, you decide.

Fucker couldn't even stay awake, much less play grab ass.

Yeah, I'm having trouble getting worked up over this one. There was no business or professional relationship, he was upfront about wanting to date her, she agreed to go on a date with him, he didn't drug her, and didn't try to stop her from leaving. She's talking about him ignoring her cues, but I'm guessing the main cue he paid attention to was her sticking around his apartment after he made it crystal clear he only brought her there to try to sleep with her. If you don't like dealing with a pushy salesman, stop hanging around the store and browsing. Come back when you're ready to buy.

Rationality? Common sense? Logic? How unlike you. Wtf?

I think I'm coming down with the flu. Half of the office is out sick today.

Get better soon?

Sounds like typical drunk guy behavior. “Hmm, I can’t get laid, maybe a blow job?” “Hmm, no blow job, maybe I can try again?” Rinse and repeat until she gets fed up and leaves.

The bar is getting set so low I’m afraid to look at women at work. My luck that my two subordinates on my case are women...

Ahhh, the love rep from the Nazi. Now I understand. You've been reduced to thinking at my primitive level. Clever.

“ignored clear non-verbal cues” - as a male (and a male with social anxiety disorders and whatnot) I certainly don't pick up on "non verbal cues" from anyone let alone a female. Sorry but this whole incident is one big steaming pile of from head-to-tail. Let's put ourselves in Aziz' shoes: we are dot Indian, and small in stature.
These two factors don't exactly scream out massive pantie-dropping from the general female population. Am I wrong ladies? Do small Indian men affect you on a deep down "sexual chemistry" level? Do small Indian men tend to sweep you off your feet? That's what I thought. So Aziz finally gets a leg up on getting some action and he's not going to put some moves on any female that shows him any interest? He didn't "Cosby" her or anything - sorry but this whole thing was handled at the lowest level and there is really nothing to see here. Mountains out of mole hills to the extreme.

I believe the accusation here boils down to the woman feeling pressured into sexual acts, with her power of consent diminished or weakened by her fear of how Ansari might have responded if she had said no or tried to leave. Even if she doesn't quite accuse him of sexual assault, it seems men's expectations of how women are supposed to respond to sexual advances can create a rapey atmosphere. Women are also apparently raised to be nice and, for lack of a better term, willing.

Personally, I feel sympathy for anyone who has an off putting sexual encounter, but some people are calling for this guy's career to be deep sixed. I don't know.

I say neuter the guy. Create even more distrust of and animosity towards womyn.

The thing that worries me about all of this is the stunning lack of due process--as if all women should be believed and the accused punished, without question, for sexual indiscretions that are not open to interpretation. But I'm not a woman, so is my perspective flawed? I don't really know. I obviously know the conservative male position on this issue, since they're usually the first to speak up and scoff.

We need a clear schedule of offenses and penalties...how about...?

Offense: Rape, (genuine) sexual assault
Statute of Limitations: None
Penalty: You're toast (fired, demoted, publicly shamed, etc.)

Offense: Indecent Exposure, Coercive Sexual Aggression, Using Employment Position to Coerce Sex/Sexual Favors
Statute of Limitations: 10/20/30 Years
Penalty: Until 10 years, you're toast; Until 20, sincere public apology, gestures to make amends; After 30, no foul

Offense: Aggressive Come-Ons, Boorish Behavior
Statute of Limitations: 6 months
Penalty: Private apology

Offense: Sexist, racy humor/comments, minor sexual transgressions
No public offense

Getting a taste of the dark side, are we?

Why do we assume she feared him if she said no?

That's great. Logical. Sensible. Open to refinement.

Except it will never be accepted by people ruled entirely by their emotions.

Your same objection might still apply, but I'd recommend the media adopt rules like these.

"Whoa, Dustin Hoffman said some inappropriate things to an intern 30 years ago? THAT'S the kinda news the public needs to know!"

Oh, man, I realized Harry Hembock of the 90's is guilty of indecent exposure, aggressive come ons, and the bit where he dry humps women's hands at a bus stop, that dances into "coercive sexual aggression".

Well...the book has a damned parental advisory label, and a cartoon explodey bubble saying he's a "horrid little man".

What else can I do? Put a little padlock on it, like those Atari porno games?

"I obviously know the conservative male position on this issue, since they're usually the first to speak up and scoff." - ohdeve

are you being sarcastic or serious? so you are telling me that the "liberal" male position wouldn't be "sheeet - I'd try to tap that ass too!" if she was hot?
Sorry but Aziz might be liberal or conservative. I don't really give a shit. Many of the "bad boys" recently accused of blatant sexual harassment are part of the liberal elite. Some are conservative - it doesn't really matter, they all better become celibate or find women (or rubber necking americans) who have no fucking idea who they are.
This is the time to be a good looking rich male who nobody has ever heard of if you want to even make eye contact with a female. If not, you have a target on your back!

She did say no, and she did leave. But between saying no and leaving, she hung around and created this awkward "maybe" space where the unpleasantness happened. Aziz couldn't remove himself from the situation, it was his apartment. He could have demanded she put out or leave immediately, but that would have been more threatening and confrontational than what actually happened. And besides, she knows he brought her there to have sex, and she's not saying yes, but she's not leaving, so maybe he's just not trying the right way?


There's a very good reason this story was broken by "babe.net," and not a major newspaper or website. Jezebel didn't even jump on it until it was already out, and they'll publish basically anything.

This is why I appreciate it when women are "forward" with me. Then I don't have to figure out what signals they are sending out (if any). I don't have to worry about offending them or being rejected - that burden is on them if they are flirting with me. For some reason Latinas are really flirty, and I support this 100 percent!

The first step is acknowledging that you have a problem.

The media is a bastion of impartiality. Hoffman was just being a silly goose. No harm, no... fowl.

Perhaps female culture could use some tweaking, the whole nonverbal signals thing just leads to confusion. Apparently she did say no, but just hung around after? Nothing was stopping her from leaving.

From what I gathered, women often fear pushy men will become rapey men.

without a "primitive level" humans would have become extinct long ago. BTW females act on that primitive level too - it takes two to tango.

Try harder.

yet she didn't fear him enough to run the fuck home the second he got pushy - she didn't call 911 or anything.

Don't you have a sponsor?