The Don't Say Gay bill

Abigail Shrier wrote a whole about how it’s trendy to say your trans because it’s gives attention seekers what they want. That and how parents are grooming their kids because they see kids as pets, IMO.

Bull.

Fucking.

Shit.


Considering how much play over the last few years this exact chart has gotten and all the fact checking proving it accurate I have a hard time believing you haven’t seen it.

Which leads me to believe that maybe the others are right about you. It seems you aren’t arguing in good faith after all. You have become completely Trumpist in that ‘pushing back’ is more important than actual facts to you.

I will think on this more.

Is a piece of shit.

Just as a fun fact,Japan for all it's conservative culture does not use pronouns in regular speech to refer to other people and in anime, I've seen male characters refer to themselves as "watashi" (the word for "I" that is used mostly by women" and people of all genders use a gender neutral "jibun" and no one bats an eye.

With all the time I've spent on Tumblr and Twitter around folks who are non binary, I've met only one who went by neopronons exclusively. Most enbies use they/them alongside the other ones they prefer. Most people are aware this won't come easily, they just ask that we try.

is a huckster and a fraud and a TERF by her own admission, so feel free to never cite the Andrew Wakefield of gender studies as any kind of "expert" ever again, thanks.

Presenting to the class. Like your new gender identity is show-and-tell, and we need to make sure all the kids think "correctly" about it.

This school gets sued no matter what the teacher does.

If the teacher corrects the kid with a Dad and a Mom, nothing happens at all.

UA and FF think this is just fine. Libertarianism at its finest. Pretend the law will be applied equally, knowing it won't.

@Paladin seems to have lost their voice so I will open the question up to anyone.

Do you know any ze/zihrs/ect?

If so please share. I’d be interesting in learning about their situation, why they chose alternative pronouns, etc.

It's more than I wanted to do on my phone. Response shortly.

Again, fine with it when referring to a person of unknown or irrelevant sex (e.g., a hypothetical person). But if someone tells me they're a "they," it's illogical. They have a definite sex, and the pronoun should conform to it.

Not a one.

Your spouse is a woman. She can identify however she wants, but the underlying biology does not change.

It all sounds very open-minded.

Here are just a few of the copious references that come up on Google...

North Dakota Health: A Guide to Using Personal Pronouns.
PinkNews.
Western Oregon University.
University of Wisconsin Milwaukee.

So, I'm pretty sure it's a real thing. I don't travel in the circles you do, but it's definitely out there.

By the way, here's UMW's pronoun list with their conjugations. Make sure y'all have this memorized by tomorrow!


(This is not a joke. This is absolutely real. See the link.)

Anyway, I'm glad to hear that in your wide circle it's not a thing because I'm never going to use "ze" or "zir" except in mock quotes.

What do you think that proves? That non-traditional gender identities are like left-handedness, something that's always been there but repressed, and not a cultural phenomenon?

Unless you believe ALL societies are repressing the trans, the non-binaries, the zes, the zirs, and the mxyzptlks the exact same way, this recent phenomena has to be ideological.

I could show you a graph of people switching from Coke to Pepsi, but it doesn't mean they were Pepsi all along and just held down.

I said that the pronouns thing is a thing, and put up links to back it up.

The question is, why would you care? You can say you don’t care, but you obviously do with this statement. You act as if your definition of who his wife is, is the authority and all must bow to it. If you didn’t care, you wouldn’t care about “underlying biology”.

So, why do you care? Are you anticipating having sex with Ancalagon’s spouse?

Nuh-uh.
Your claim, you define and/or demonstrate what it is you're so against.

yet here you continue to post what you think are gotchas and non sequiturs with no apparent intent other to be inflammatory...

I do. One xe, one zir (and several theys). I don’t know why. Was before singular known they was really a thing, so maybe that’s the reason, but I never asked.

I am and I think you have read my reasoning behind preferring new pronouns. I will say that the use of new pronouns really should not be used on those transexual people who undergo the change and are gendered under the he/she format. The inclusion of new pronouns I think makes the language more adept at communication and the nuances in non-english languages are ones that have been established over much more time and make the languages more versatile and interesting as they evolve. This means that new pronouns are really for everyone's use as a more nuanced vocabulary that conveys more meaning.

It has always been taught to me that we have more words to use than just simple ones and that makes language better, more nuanced, and inclusive. The whining about learning something new is really childish and seems to be a desire to remain stupid. We should treat it as such IMO which is why new pronouns would be awesome.

That said I am not for cancelling an idiot, just putting idiots in their proper lane.

Same... we have a few NB folks at work. Some of them might also identify with the new pronouns, but it hasn't really been an issue.

Usually if someone is repeatedly misgendering them it's only a matter of subtly stepping in and explaining "so and so prefers 'they'." and a mental note gets made to remember that. Ain't really any skin off of anybody's knee.

Exactly. It's not rocket science. It's the same if I call someone by the wrong name inadvertently. They I politely correct me, I apologize, make an effort not to fuck up their name moving forward, and it's not an issue.

Paladin is taking the approach of calling someone Bob, and when they correct him and say "my name is actually Joe," he doubles down and says "nah, you look like a Bob so I'm gonna call you Bob." That is called being a dick. Except he's being a dick very specifically to transgendered people only, and so that's called being a bigot.

Long since answered. I am against collective guilt for sins of the father. I will not have children automatically divided into victims and oppressors based on intrinsic attributes. I will not have teachers saying ignorant shit like "all white people are racists who need to acknowledge their privilege."

What about teachers who say all black people are lazy? That was the norm when I entered school in the late 60s.

Teachers are people who live in the world today. They will say things that are the norm all day every day. All white people are racists is not the norm in everyday usage. Sure, there may be teachers that say ignorant things. Those teachers need to be corrected directly and individually, not a generalization against all teachers.

But you'll lap up the collective treasure.

To the extent there is a collective treasure, everyone benefits from it.

In truth, I don't care how anyone identifies.

What I do care about is making sure people aren't punished if they don't accept ot endorse those identities.

Go ahead and identify as Napoleon Bonaparte, but I ain't calling you "your Excellency."

You do know that what you are saying here is not happening. No one is being punished for not saying a specific pronoun. But, I bet you'd get your undies twisted six ways to Sunday if someone mispronounced your name. Even worse if someone called you a she. So, again, why do you care? and don't like about anyone being punished.

But Jordon Peterson says...!

Oh, dear.

It's impolite to purposefully mispronounce my name. But I'm not going to force someone to do it correctly.

I'm male. It's a mistake (or a challenge) to call me a she. But if someone doesn't call me by the correct pronoun, I'm not going to make a federal case out of it.

If we're free from compulsion to say anything we don't agree with, I'm satisfied. But that's not where this is headed.

Hey! We all respect your choices and call you a cunt.

We're in Canada now? Some posters on this board are, yes. But, you and I are not. You've not provided a sufficient answer. Why do YOU care?

Shhh, you’re ruining the narrative.

See the links I posted above, particularly the guidelines from the University of Wisconsin Milwaukee.

Why I care? I've already said. I do not want to be compelled to endorse anyone's self-identity.

But, why? This is what I don't understand. Why would you even care if someone asks "call me they"?