We're all on the same page about Amber Heard, right?

No disagreements here, but it still doesn't make sense to me that Depp loses one defamation trial and then wins another over the same activities. Did Heard just have much shittier lawyers who couldn't even copy the UK newspapers winning argument verbatim?

I don't know the differences in the legal requirements or which details that court was allowed to see, but there were allegations the judge had some conflict of interest. Tenuous allegations, with a fair bit of separation and no real proof.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ne...lity-question-amber-heard-trial-1712025?amp=1

Ugh. Why?

The jury also found in favor of Heard's counterclaim for defamation. But the net result of damages is in Depp's favor.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/01/entertainment/johnny-depp-amber-heard-verdict/index.html

[Heard's lawyer]Objection, hearsay, calls for speculation[/Heard's lawyer]

IANAL but this summary seems pretty cut and dried.

Never before has histrionic personality disorder, borderline personality disorder or narcissistic personality disorder have been discussed to this extent. Amber won! Thank you Amber! And I'm not being ironic, I'm a sufferer myself. Our image is bad, we are a nuisance to our fellow human beings. We are really obnoxious, a pain in the ass, no doubt about that .... But still... The trial gave a little insight into our broken minds.

I am a borderliner and a narcissist. In the clinical sense. I have the diagnosis, officially. But you grow out of it when you get older. Slowly.

Let the abuse begin!

Are we all on the same page? People may dump on Amber Heard as a result of this but will it cause them to question the problematic "automatically believe the victim" principle in other cases where accusations are levelled? It should.

I suspect the social implications are the main reason why many people here are abstaining from full-on antagonizing her, regardless of the facts of the case.

Dude, it's not all about you...

Brilliant!

Are you suggesting we go back to the way things were and a man can beat his wife all he wants? And he can deny it. And everyone believes him because he’s a man and she was probably asking for it if it’s even true?

This is so not a response I would have expected from you.

I don't think it's problematic to assume most people are not making up the abuse they've received. Amber Heard is one prominent exception and we shouldn't hold her up as an excuse to slag off all victims.

The standard should be to take claims of abuse seriously and give all parties due process. The standard should not be to assume categorically that the claims are true.

Considering the claims in which the woman is lying are the only ones that make the news, I can see where someone would make such an absurd statement. However, for every claim in which the woman is lying, there are literally tens of thousands of claims that do not get reported.

So, fuck off every man. I will always believe a woman’s claim of abuse over any man’s denial.

Due process -- absurd.

"Men are always the victimizers and women are always honest" -- not absurd.

The great wisdom of @Jenee.

UK was a judge trial, US was a jury trial - that's 90% of it right there.

Same guy wrote up his perspective in a guest article here:

https://www.readthepresentage.com/p/johnny-depp-amber-heard

More like Amber Turd, am I right?

Yeah, obviously I'm suggesting that. It is the only possible alternative to the presumption of guilt.

If someone tells me they're being abused and need help, I will believe them, and do whatever I can to help without any fact checking. They need support and encouragement to leave the situation? Sure, I'm on it. They need help grabbing all their shit and getting out while the abuser is at work? I'm on that too. I've done both these things more than once. There are two things I won't do: help someone cope with staying in an abusive situation, or helping someone punish an alleged abuser in any way.

When it comes to "believe reports of abuse," yeah, definitely. It seems like the default response of most people when they're told about abuse is to deny it. I've been in the situation myself. When talking about my emotionally and psychologically abusing father, I most often got responses like "I don't know, he seems pretty cool to me," or "it probably wasn't that bad" from people who don't even know my dad. My ex who was from Austria, while I wouldn't describe her as abuse, she was definitely manipulative. I told a few people from my polyamory group about the manipulative things she'd done, and their response was "but she seems so nice!" Yeah, manipulative people tend to be charming. If someone says "I'm being abused," responding with "you're lying" doesn't help anyone. This is what the "believe women" thing is about. If someone is talking about abuse, don't argue with them.

When it comes time to do something about said abuse, that's when it gets tricky. If someone needs support, I'll do it as long as it doesn't turn into enabling. If someone needs help getting out, of course. Even if someone is lying, these things don't really harm anyone. They need help going to the police? Probably fine. Publicly ostracizing or socially shunning the abuser? That depends, and I'm going to need evidence. Vigilante justice? Yeah, I'm not helping with that.

I've known far too many people who have openly talked about lying about abuse to get what they want, and I've been on the receiving end a few times as well. If someone comes to me and is all "My ex is an abusive piece of shit, I want this blasted all over social media. Everyone email his boss and try to get him fired. Also, stop talking to him or I'll stop talking to you," I am immediately suspicious, and my first thought is that it's at best an "everyone sucks here" situation.

That’s exactly why I said what I said. If it’s all over social media, someone in more interested in attention than ending an abusive situation. If someone is in an abusive situation, you’ll probably only ever hear about it once from the victim. And I will believe them.