Israel is Coming Apart at the Seams, It Seems

"My history"

For reference:

Rick is doing the same thing, reducing the incidents of weaponized sexual assault committed by Hamas to just another bingo space of eyeroll-worthy Israeli statements.

What do you think Rick is implying with his cutesy bingo card?

That doesn’t matter. He’s stuck around longer than those who abused him, so it’s like it never happened.

Actually my view is that like many of the claims made about October 7th, claims of sexual violence are dramatically over-stated for shock effect. There isn't a single person from the attack itself or among the released hostages who has made a rape allegation. If it happened, it was certainly not in a systematic way.

This expectation that the people you have tortured, starved, and abused are going to all adhere to some rules of war morality that @14thDoctor has presented as the reason he is against them is absurd. Are we to really believe that if Hamas just didn't rape people that people like 14th wouldn't be flipping their shit?

This is such an intellectually dishonest argument. There is nothing short of killing themselves in the most painful way possible with an apology to zionists for existing that would make 14th happy. Even then he would complain about them dirtying the planet with their blood or something. This is a raging anti-Islam bigot here, and zionist radical suprioritist.

The reality is that the people attacking Isreal were not an army with a real command and mission. This is a surviving gand in an open air prison who has revolted against the guards. Rape is a terrible tactic for an armed assault. Really, it takes time and effort to do. It is what a beat up gang of angry militants is going to do. That does not excuse it to admit it, but it does make a difference in how you change things if you want to somehow rehab things into peace. In the case of those arguing for the genocide of palestinians, that is not what they want. The zionists do not just want to control the area, they want to kill everyone there. That is why they are trying to make them all into a raping gang, when the reality is there are lot less rapey ones than there are ones who are just fighting back.

As the palestinians are outgunned and outmanned I really do not expect them to be over there telling abdul the rapist they cannot use him to shoot the guards of the open air prison. It is on Isreal to not put civilians in danger from their prisoners in Gaza. If you are going to make an outdoor prison to slowly steal the land and squeeze the locals to an impoverished death it is on you to do the oppression.

It is like abusing a dog. If you keep kicking it all the time, it is your fucking fault if you get bit. You don't blame the dog for becoming savage and biting you.

I see there's now a deal to let extra medical aid in, in exchange for some of it being made available for the hostages. The fact that these things are being used as negotiating chips is outrageous.

Yes, this is much more honest. Let them fight and do as they will and cut off any money to either side. Isreal wants aid? We will send them all the gauze and antibiotics they want. We will evem sell them Iron dome missiles, but no more financial aid. Of course, we will sell iron dome to the palestinians if they want it.

Sounds like a plan I can agree on. Cut Isreal off. No more support, and let them do what they want with Gaza.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ual-violence-rape-hostages-oct-7/71917113007/

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7079535

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/28/world/middleeast/oct-7-attacks-hamas-israel-sexual-violence.html

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181.amp

https://www.reuters.com/world/un-ex...xual-torture-during-hamas-attacks-2024-01-08/

Remember that hospital that the IDF levelled with missile, killing 500 people inside? Rick was so mad about it that he couldn't bring himself to post for a couple days.

Except there was no IDF missile, it was a failed terrorist rocket, and the hospital wasn't levelled, it was only the parking lot that was slightly damaged.

Meanwhile there's ample evidence that Hamas was raping and decapitating their victims before murdering them, and Rick is saying those claims are "exaggerated," and even if it all happened he brushes it off with "it wasn't systemic," like that somehow un-rapes and un-decapitates all those people.


I'm so glad Rick is unbiased and reasonable about all of this.

What I don’t get is he asks for evidence. Nobody wants to see that shit, but it’s out there. It was bad enough to watch that video of journalists being hanged or drowned or whatever about ten years ago.

He demands evidence when it's an Israeli claim, and then finds a way to dismiss or downplay what happened even if you do produce evidence. But when Hamas claims something, he'll gladly repost it without even the courtesy of a link to the claims.

But yeah, Rick saying "there isn't a single person from the attack" claiming rape is especially scummy considering they were decapitated and murdered during or after those rapes.

Pro tip: Very few murder victims make public statements claiming they were murdered after the fact.

Rape victims notoriously don’t like to talk about their rape.

That's very heavy on anonymous sources. Anonymous doctors. Anonymous military personnel. Anonymous hostages. Oh, and quotes from pro-Israeli lobby groups.

No specific victims. No actual evidence. And did you know that they refuse to co-operate with international bodies conducting investigations?

Nope. Might be something there but it doesn't pass the smell test especially given their track record. It's worth reviewing the 40 beheaded babies story, which people seem to have moved on from without a murmur. There were similarly hysterical claims, little evidence and it's clear now that it could not have been true since there was only one infant among the casualties on October 7th.
(A look earlier in the thread shows that I was hesitant to believe it but became convinced there was something to it. Not again.)

But this is what you do if you're trying to justify starving a million kids in plain sight I suppose.

No, what you don't get is that evidence is different from "some fat, drunk cunt with a primary school intellect who happens to have a YouTube channel".

Right?

He also believes that television pictures of the freed hostages that suggested they had not been physically abused were misleading. "I think it was very deceptive," said Pessach. "There's not a single person that came back that didn't have a significant physical injury or a medical problem. On top of that, some of them were getting medication, to look better than they actually were."

There were also stories of hostages being branded (a common practice inflicted on Jews and other prisoners of Nazi concentration camps during the Holocaust), and of being sexually abused. "Yes, we did see signs of branding," Pessach said. "We definitely saw signs of being handcuffed. We did hear and see evidence of sexual abuse in a significant part of the people we have treated. We also heard evidence – and that was one of the hardest parts – of abuse against those that [are still there], both physical and sexual."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/doctor...ibes-physical-sexual-and-psychological-abuse/

Here's Haaretz on 4th January.

https://www.haaretz.co.il/news/law/...2980000?gift=0d660f6ae8134267b732f295253d7d35

"The police are having difficulty locating victims of sexual assault from the Hamas attack, or people who witnessed such attacks, and decided to appeal to the public to encourage those who have information on the matter to come forward and give testimony. Even in the few cases in which the organization collected testimony about sexual offenses committed on October 7, it failed to connect the acts with the victims who were harmed by them."

This. Nature abhors a vacuum, and human intellect is often of the same disposition. If one must argue in bad faith to create a point of contention for why people are being slaughtered, then one is not looking for truth, only a crutch to support that genocide. That's what we're witnessing here. We've seen this happen far too many times throughout history, this notion that "the opposing army wants to rape your women," and it seeks to activate that base reaction deep within our brains that lashes out without thinking. People who make these mass accusations do this in the hopes that you will lash out without thinking. Nothing, NOTHING justifies the murder of 12,000 children, but there are people who make the damned effort to try.

You know how I know you're a piece of shit? Because in 2020 when Tara Reade accused Biden of sexually assaulting her decades ago, you were blasting anyone that dared point out the sketchiness of her claims as a "rape apologist/rape enthusiast/worse than actual rapists" and all other sorts of hysterical nonsense.

Now look how your attitude changes when it's Hamas being accused of sexually assaulting people. Even when there's proof in the form of videos and photographs shared by Hamas themselves.

That's how I know you're a piece of shit.

Wasn’t she the Putin lover who defected to Russia? Boy those allegations really didn’t pan out.

I think all three of you (14th dr, FF, and Amaris) are fucked in the head if you want to discuss how you think women “should” respond to rape. It’s bad enough you assholes do it, now you fucking want to tell us how we should respond?

Fuck the fuck right the fuck off.

I strongly suspect the first two words in your statement are wrong if that's what you got out of my post.

Have a lovely day.

Wasn’t what was said specifically. Just that it was discussed at all.

You're not allowed to say that, 2020 Amaris is gonna call you names for days

But yeah, "Joe Biden fingered me a couple decades ago, as compensation I demand he hand the 2020 nomination to Bernie, no need to involve the cops or the courts" was a real Hail Mary. Partial credit for trying, I guess?

The Muslim world is so unified in their hatred of Israel and their protection of Palestine that they are a) doing nothing to actually help the Palestinians and b) are firing missiles at each other now.

Must be a day ending in -y.

In the meantime, we just keep finding out more and more Israeli hostages have been dead for weeks, the Hamas leadership is on the run, Gaza has been taken over, and the only thing that Hamas has accomplished is making the life of 2 million Palestinians absolute shit. Saudi Arabia says it will continue to normalize relations with Israel once the war is over.

Random thought:

I've noticed my Jewish friends have been posting very little about the subject, despite generally sympathetic FB conversations a few months ago.

That's at least partly due to accepting there's some truth that there've been atrocities committed by both HAMAS and the IDF.

I'm still of the mind that as Israel was created by the UN (in no small part because no other nation of the time wanted Jews in their borders), it's the UN's responsibility to impose a ceasefire and arbitration... this shits been going on for nearly 75 years.

Typical bully take. Why do the palestinians keep making Isreal hit them. If they would just stop existing and making Isreal mad they would not get hit anymore.

Meanwhile the Isreali genocide excusers have gone on to bitch about tara Reade? OK, that shows a serious lack of any sort of real argument when you have to distract like that.

It's not about people dying, it's about winning whatever moral argument keeps them on top. That's why I just block them instead of debating anymore. There's no intention to learn, only to yell continuously about how "right" they are, no matter the subject.

Yesterday they blew up the last remaining univeristy in Gaza. Detonated in another controlled explosion, something they have subjected entire neighbourhoods to.

And despite frenzied denials three months ago that - perish the thought - Israel would ever bomb a hospital, they attacked and forced the last remaining hospital to close as well. There used to be 36.

Press leaks in the US has the Biden Admin expressing "frustration" and expecting a move to a lower intensity soon. But as these have become regular - and have no effect, one must conclude that they are for PR purposes only. Also yesterday the US Congress voted against a proposal to monitor (not even set conditions, just to monitor) Israeli compliance with human rights.

In other news, an Israeli hostage was held in the hospital at Nasser in Southern Gaza for several months along with her 2 three year old children and her husband. She said between 35-40 hostages were held there and that clearly that at least some of the hospital staff knew they were there.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/17/...ge-says-held-in-gaza-hospital-intl/index.html

She was released along with her two children. Her husband is still held hostage.