BONDage: a 007 Thread in Anticipation of SKYFALL

An interesting surprise while viewing Tomorrow Never Dies tonight.

I noticed a famous (now, but not then) name in the credits, listed as one of the sailors on the ill-fated H.M.S. Devonshire. I went back through the scenes on the ship and, sure enough, I found him.

For years, I've noted the lad with the Scottish accent who says "We're now down fourteen degrees by the stern" but says it like "We're na' down fairteen degrees by the stairn." But I didn't notice that the guy looked a little familiar, even on this viewing.

That's him in the background below. Do you recognize him?

Brief change of topic, I bought the 50th Anniversary blu ray box set yesterday. Fuck me, the remastering of the films is really something else. I think I ejaculated at least several times as the Bond theme rang out in crisp high def sound. The picture quality of the films are amazing as well.

Buy it or GTFO!

I know. If it was worthy of Austin Powers, it's a good indication that it was too campy for Bond.

it's a phenomenal transfer. i was positively surprised too - those 30,40 year old movies look and sound better than many productions from the 00s. must have been a lot of work cleaning them up.

Best bond villain base?

So now I've seen Skyfall. I was disappointed, unfortunately.

Don't spoil it Irish!

Gee...what a surprise. Not.

I did like Casino Royale. But you're right that it's not my type of thing.

Without spoilers, would you care to expand on that?

Weak villain & weak, illogical plot. Some good action though.

You just described 90% of James Bond films.

Saw Skyfall tonight and enjoyed it tremendously. Not quite Casino Royale, but a considerable improvement over Quantum of Solace.

I love the grittier, more realistic take on Bond in the Craig pictures. No improbable take-over-the-world plots, no ridiculous gadgets from Q (although a funny aside about that), no eye-rolling gimmick stunts, and (if you'll excuse me) no absurd volcano lairs. This film has a strong air of verisimilitude: it shows us a world where intelligence services are run by bureaucrats and limited by the demands of politics.

Theme song? Awesome. And I liked the opening credit sequence. But they moved the "gun barrel" part to the end!

Nu-Q? Worked well. I liked that he gave as well as he got when bickering with Bond and that they sorta formed an instant camaraderie. Generally speaking, I don't like young geniuses (think: Wesley Crusher), but I liked the new Q. No over-the-top gadgets this time, but he gives Bond a gun that only Bond can fire. I'm thinking it will figure in the climax, but, no, it gets used in the plot exactly how you think it will about fifteen minutes later.

Bond Girls? A little uninspiring this time around. Naomie Harris is cute as Eve, but it's unclear if Bond "sealed the deal" with her. Berenice Marlohe looked awful to me in the Chinese hooker get-up; she was much more attractive in "plainer" mode. Still, Bond had much sweeter companions (Gemma Arterton, Olga Kurylenko) for the last go-around.

[?=Spoilers ahead]I have to disagree with RickDeckard that the villain was weak. On the contrary, I thought Silva was a fantastic, interesting villain, ultimately FAR more memorable than Le Chiffre or Dominic Green. He has a terrific introduction where he goes off on a monologue that, at first, has you thinking "What the f***?" before it comes around to a meaningful conclusion. Yes, he's clearly insane as well as brilliant, but he's (IMHO) captivating to watch and his motivations seem powerfully real. Another great psycho performance from Javier Bardem.

I will agree the plot had some weaknesses, mainly some absurdities and some contrived conveniences. The idea that an assassin would use depleted uranium rifle bullets is nothing short of ridiculous, for many reasons not least of which would be the stupidity of leaving an obvious calling card. Also, the same assassin is tracked to Shanghai, not through any detective work by MI-6, but simply a tip from the CIA. Also, I'll have to watch again, but I'm not sure how Bond was able to piece together a critical password that unlocks encrypted data. Finally, if you're going to arrange a standoff in a remote place with the bad guy (who is himself similar in capability to Bond), shouldn't you bring some really badass weaponry?

And, if being Joker-like wasn't enough, Silva pulls a stunt right out of The Dark Knight: the (now) old I-meant-to-get-caught-so-I-could-get-into-your-headquarters routine.

But I consider these fairly minor. The basic thrust of the plot--a former MI-6 agent seeks revenge on M for selling him out to the Chinese years before--is solid and works. Bardem sells it well (the part where he discusses cyanide poisoning--and shows the result--is quietly horrifying) and, doggone it, we've really grown to like M (Judi Dench).

And this is really almost as much M's movie as it is Bond's. I really like the portrayal of their relationship. She DOES have some affection for him, and he DOES truly respect her.

Some reviewers seem to take issue with the third act. I thought it was great, except for the aforementioned lack of forethought with regard to firepower. Loved Silva's entrance; yes, he does make them grandly.

A few more words...

[?=Serious spoilers in here]
Sad to see Judi Dench go, but she gets a great part and a good death scene.

Didn't care for the new Moneypenny so much. The actress is fine, but I don't like the idea that she was an operative. And the way they communicated the revelation that Eve was Moneypenny was awkward; felt like an afterthought. It parallels the "Robin" revelation in The Dark Knight Rises.

Hey! That's Albert Finney showing up as Kincaid, the Bond family's gamekeeper. Nice unexpected bonus.

The Aston Martin!!! And M: "Go ahead and eject me!"

Liked Ralph Fiennes' role in this, which was a more-nuanced-than-usual politician. I like that he became M at the end. I hope he'll continue in the roll.[/?][/?]
All-in-all, Bond's back in good form. 8/10

Gonna try and catch this one sometime this weekend!

Spot the Donnerverse fan.....

It hasn't been at the beginning of the movie since Die Another Day.

Personally I don't like the new Q. I do like the new Moneypenny though.

Agreed. He wasn't remotely weak at all.

When were they going to get this weaponry? Bond and M flee Silva's attack. They don't stop off at a gun shop along the way.

It's clear that he's been set up to replace Dench. I couldn't have thought of anyone better.

Indeed. As you're aware, "Verisimilitude!" was Donner's motto for Superman: The Movie. I think it's a good idea for Bond as well.

Actually, it was in the beginning of Casino Royale, when Bond kills the guy in the bathroom. Don't remember about Quantum of Solace; haven't watched that one too many times.

Within the movie's own logic, it works. But, really, considering Q had to lay a breadcrumb trail for Silva to find them, Bond could've said send a dozen heavily-armed SAS guys to Skyfall BEFORE you lay down that trail. Although I guess one could counter-argue that Silva's computer hacking skills were so great, he would've gotten wise to anything like that...

Fiennes is terrific. I never thought it out of the realm of possibility that HE could be Bond.

This says it better than I could. Spoilers obviously. YMMV.

Here's a question:

If James Bond were a real person, how OLD would he (have to) be? ALL of the James Bond films to date are all in the same canonuity, so wouldn't he be in his 80s? Or, as I've seen suggested, perhaps on this very board(?), is James Bond really an assigned identity (almost like a title &/or role or "role"), perhaps James Bond was once a real man who worked in UK Intelligence, & afterward succeeding agents use that name as their's for when they're working in espionage.

James Bond's father:
At this point either Sean Connery or Roger Moore could play James Bond's father, ala Indiana Jones's father in "IJ & the Last Crusade". Of the two I'd prefer Connery. But if Connery weren't available use Moore.

The 60's comedy version of "Casino Royale", actually took that tack.

No they are not. It's unclear what was going on beforehand but Casino Royale was a reboot.

Well, sorta.

Consider just one historical aspect: the Cold War.

Craig's Bond is entirely a post-Cold War product. Dialogue in Casino Royale confirms that Bond didn't become a double-0 until well after the Cold War was over.

Brosnan's Bond oversaw the end of the Cold War. Goldeneye begins with Bond and 006 raiding a Soviet chemical weapons factory, then fast forwards 8 years to after the fall of the Soviet Union. Bond is even referred to by M as "a relic of the Cold War."

Moore's and Dalton's Bonds are very much in the heart of the Cold War, and the plots frequently revolve around the villain trying to instigate war between the U.S. and the Soviet Union.

Connery's (and, by extension, Lazenby's) Bonds were operating in the Cold War, but it's usually not the Commies who are the enemy. Only in From Russia with Love does Bond do any actual work to undermine the Communist bloc: smuggling an encoding machine out of the Soviet embassy in Istanbul.

Bond has evolved with the times, so, in a historical sense, there can't really be one continuity. Still, the films do call back to earlier episodes: references to Bond's wife occur in For Your Eyes Only and License to Kill, Bond has the same Astin-Martin from Goldfinger in Skyfall.

As I said above, the historical context makes it impossible for Bond to be viewed as a single continuous character over all the films. At best, he's only quasi-continuous.

Nope. It's clear--especially after Skyfall--that James Bond is the character's real name. His parents were Andrew and Monique Bond.

And, yes, it's always bugged me that a so-called secret agent runs around using his REAL name. It reached a high point of absurdity when, in one of the Moore films, someone says something like "he's a FAMOUS British agent." Uh, a famous agent is a WORTHLESS agent. But you go with it...

Alas, Bond's father is deceased. Roger Moore is getting a little slow these days, so I doubt he could act in any significant role in a modern Bond film. Haven't seen Connery in a while, but it would be a hoot for him to be a villain. (I heard at one point Connery was interested in playing M to [IIRC] Jude Law's Bond.)

I use the inverse alternate timeline theory.

We're seeing Bond along different hyper-time slices to suit the culture of the day, but from Bond's perspective, something like the Lazenby/Dalton/Brosnan/Craig adventures happened to Connery-Bond in his prime.

Likewise, something like the Connery/Lazenby/Dalton adventures happened to Brosnan-Bond.

And, it was so much alike, it hardly makes a difference.

Interesting application & use of alternate timelines/parallel universes, if/assuming I understand you correctly.

Finally saw it too. It made me realize what the three modern Bonds lack: charm. I love Craig in the role, but if you wrote 'well done generic action movie' on the posters, they'd still be OK. Even at the heigth of Moore shengians or Brosnan implausibility Bond was quite unmistakable. Now he's not.

I'm sorry but Bond needs to be bigger. More epic. Bond needs to be awesome. We have a whole array of 'human' action stars like Jason Bourne these days. They bleed and have personal problems. Bond doesn't have problems. Hit by a stray bullet? Dry remark and done. It's not what the whole movie should be about. I'm not interested in his personal traumas or reflections on getting older. These things might make one good dialogue (which we had in GOLDENEYE) but that's it. He's an artificial figure, a fantasy, he does not need a life outside Vodka-Martinis, girls and blowing up volcano headquarters.

Yes, I'm that old fashioned. I want awesome Bond back. Doesn't mean the story must be completely out of the ball park but give it a little more breathing room. QoS and SKYFALL are a little too personal for my taste. CASINO ROYALE is of course good but suffers from the same problem of being rather small scale.

However, there is some beautiful cinematography in this movie. It borders on too cool videogame aesthetics in the Shanghai sequence. The scenes in Scotland are breathtaking, as is the bad guy's island.

Adele's song is great and a wonderful hommage.

Javier Bardem stole the show whenever he was on screen. Too bad the script didn't make him a real bad guy. Those are actually boring in the new movies. In CR we had a bookkeeper. In QoS we had another bookkeeper. Here we have a spoiled computer brat who obviously didn't understand the rules of the game he was playing - but his mommy knew and he's still pissed. They are IMHO not Bond-worthy adversaries, just like those drug lords he was up against in previous films. Bardem as Blofeld? Bring. It. ON.

Of course the ending is pure genius. I hope they run with it and don't just forget that it happend for the next one. I could not find a .jpg of that file online, but I wonder what it says. Could it be... hmmm... so many possibilities!

I thought it just said For Your Eyes Only: 007.

And I think I found the island, which was creepy as fuck:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hashima_Island

Though it was likely an exterior set at Pinewood.

Very entertaining, Craig is really growing on me as Bond. The villain was played very well, even if I did find his motivations a bit bizarre. But wouldn't be a Bond villain if he wasn't slightly mental.

so I used...alternative means...to catch most of skyfall last night - being as i'm not a huge fan of the whole Bond franchise, I wasn't paying THAT close attention and i didn't get to finish.

but what i did pick up was a general theme of "am i too old for this shit?" underlying the plot. which provokes in me the question:

How much similarity is there in the "feel" of Skyfall and that of "The Wrath of Khan"?

The "I'm too old for this shit", thing was done by Connery in "Never Say Never Again".

How does that one compare, folks?

But there it makes sense, given how that movie was made and how Connery was dragged out of retirement for it . Classic Bond quips that breaks the fourth wall for all 'in the know'. But in SKYFALL, there is absolutely no motivation behind it but to make him seem more 'human'. Craig is 44 so his Bond must be about the same age which is about ideal. I never saw the character being 25 or something. Now that would be unbelievable.

Again, it's not a bad movie and I have very high hopes that they return to a more classic style in the next one.

Can someone explain why Silva made the underground train crash through the hole he blew open while making his way to Parliament?