California High-Speed Rail: Later, Slower, and Way Over Budget

I rode Amtrak twice in the last week, after having never taken it before. Relaxing and timely. Trains, baby!

A possibly self-serving shapshot of info is hardly enough to form basis for valid conclusions.

The more you know, the more you know how much you don't know.

To sing Amtrak's praises because the northeast corridor may have had a profitable day on small bits of its track is preposterous. I'm not saying you have to know every single tidbit of amtrak's financials, but c'mon, the most populous concentration of people in the US might earn a profit when viewed as a micro subset? Really? And to be frank I mistrust the data about acela anyway.

Acela is my preference for Boston-NYC travel. Both plane and car can suck it for that particular trip.

Do you have a link on that? I'm interested in reading more and that seems to only be part of the article.

Assuming he isn't lying (and he's a Congressman, Republican, and Floridian so I'm making a big leap here), someone is fucking something up in Accounting or Procurement if Amtrak is spending $3.40 per can of Pepsi. You can definitely get it cheaper than Amazon's 75 cents per can rate, and it costs barely anything if you get a soda dispenser installed (though, that may be tougher on a train). Hell, you can get it even cheaper if you buy generic soda.

Their burgers are shit and I'm surprised anyone pays the $9.50, but again--who is fucking up so much that Amtrak is paying $16.15 for shitty burgers?

Someone is padding the bill.

What do you mean fucking up? They're obviously getting a kickback.

That would certainly fall under the "fucking up" category. Is there any evidence of that? I was thinking more likely they just went with some shitty food/beverage contracts.

Amtrak is fueled by unicorn farts!

"I don't understand, where does all this come from? How do you get funding for something like this?"

"You don't actually think they spend $20,000.00 on a hammer, $30,000.00 on a toilet seat do you?"

It's a government program. It's MOSTLY padding.

Well, I'd say that it's pretty obvious that someone is making money hand over fist, even if Amtrak claims it isn't them.

I also would be interested in seeing where the numbers come from. At first glance I would say it has labor and labor liabilities cost factored in. Let's say a line cook is $20 bucks an hour in pay and benefits. If 20 cheeseburgers are sold, then each cheeseburger has $1 of labor costs in it. However if only 1 cheeseburger is sold then that cheeseburger has $20 of labor costs alone in it.

Amtrak has a shitton of these legacy routes that criss cross the nation. They make pennies on the dollar, but for political reasons are near impossible to cut (and even then Congress forces Amtrak to spend millions to continually study if they can be reopened, see The Pioneer)

I also have to wonder if to get they number they aren't attaching pension and healthcare liabilities to operations to get the number.

A post from earlier that is relevant.

Again, back when I was on active duty, doing IT for a 3 star and his staff, I got all kinds of government pricing catalogs. They had a really nice Thinkpad for only $999--special government price. I was debating whether or not it would be ethical for me to buy a personal computer at the special government price. On a whim I spec'ed out the same computer just through NewEgg or something. Joe Blow, off the street could buy the same computer off the shelf with no special discounts for...wait for it...$799. The program set up to guarantee the government the best prices has become a way for vendors to soak the taxpayer to line their own pockets. THAT is what regulation does in a free market system. It costs more and reduces efficiency.

On the other hand, do we really want DoD systems to just be off the shelf? Not saying security costs have to be $200 extra, but there is something to be said for not just allowing the lowest cost system at the time to plug into the network.

What if it was a Lenovo?

Thing is, that has nothing to do with security and everything to do with having a GSA contract. Essentially a GSA contract is a license to steal from the Federal government. It says you've jumped through a lot of bureaucratic hoops and filled out a lot of paperwork that makes you an authorized provider. But because of all the work to get approved, it costs time and money to get a GSA contract and is a barrier to a firm that doesn't have one--both of which are incentives to jack up the prices on things sold through a GSA contract. You tack on a little something for all your effort and a little something more because Bob's Electronics down the street can't. The result? The very regulation designed to reduce gouging creates an incentive to gouge.

But Volpone, people are NICE!!! They will sell at a good price just 'cause.

Great. To support these legacy routes that are giant money pits, Amtrak is cutting funding to medium distance (less than 750 miles) that recieve state subsidies. So if you are a state that wants a train to run 8x a day instead of just 4x, you now have to pay the total cost for all 8 trips or stop paying for the extra four trips.

That's bad, bad, bad this early on. One of the issues with train travel in many corridors is flexibility. Having multiple options on when you get to a destination and when you leave. That's why every time an extra train has been added to the Portland-Seattle leg of the Cascades ridership has increased more than just that train. It's also why fare box recovery (% of operating costs covered by fares) increases per added train.

Luckily Fare Box Recovery has reached the point on the Cascades where the State can cover Amtraks portion, but it's yet another reason Amtrak needs to be depoliticized. They shouldn't be cutting funding to routes that a) are medium distance thus in rails sweet spot b) have state support so costs are already lower c) are actually GROWING and are quickly approaching break even on operating costs to throw money into the money pits that are the long haul routes.

http://seattletransitblog.com/2012/09/01/wsdot-intercity-rail-update/

On the one hand I think it's just greedy rural legislators that want more money for their pet pork project, and since the routes themselves only continue to lose more, they've got to raid the money from somewhere, but on the other I have to wonder if long term there aren't powers pushing for this as a way to kill Amtrak all together. Take away all the decent routes leaving Amtrak with only the long haul loss leaders....

LOL

Reading back through this thread and stumbled on this post. Weren't you just complaining about Delta losing your luggage last week?!?! You've been holding that grudge for a while now.

All that hate's gonna burn you up inside boy.

Jesus it's like you guys can't let go of the past. I bet for almost six fucking years you've had this thread bookmarked.

I rarely write completely new 'long' posts these days as I'm generally on my phone or tablet, am lazy and y'all just ain't worth it. So I go run a search on the subject with me as the poster, go back through the old threads, copy/paste relevant paragraphs, edit as necessary (in case my opinions have shifted, new knowledge is available or to make flow if splicing from different posts or even threads) and BAM! new post.

If I were a man who still had something to lose, that warning would give me pause. But it is too late for me. I have lost my luggage, and I am never going to get it back.

BTW, it's been nine years and we're no closer to that HSR line than we were in 2008 :s

The I-4 link between Tampa and Orlando was designed to accomodate HSR and all the right of ways were long since acquired when Rick Scott told Obama to shove the money for the route. So because of that act of political spite, the money went down the California rathole. The Tampa route would be finished by now, and work would probably be underway on the Tampa/Miami link. Thousands of people would have had had good paying jobs and Florida might have some inkling of how to ease it's traffic jam, but fucking Obama was much more important.

Dude, Democrats own both the Governorship and a supermajority in the legislature for that state. Republicans hold no real power at all. Stop making excuses.

They didn't when I posted that.