it does not at all undermine what I said. Put on your reading glasses (and thinking cap) for a second. I said "some of their neighbors" didn't like them working for the U.S. military - I did not say "all" or even "most of."
My father served during the Korean War. But he was (get this) stationed in Tripoli, Libya. There was no shootin' going on when I was on active duty in the Navy in the early 1980s.
well Einstein I wasn't in Gulf War version 1 - I was in the 2003 version. And yes I was within range of enemy small arms fire but not on a daily basis. I was however within range of mortars on a daily basis for much of my tour. And of course every time I rolled in a vehicle convoy I was within range of IED's, RPG's, small arms and pretty much everything insurgents could get their hands on, since that is when we were the most vulnerable. I don't think you quite grasp the concept of a "combat zone." It's not like only combat MOS (Military Occupational Specialty) soldiers are in the combat zone, and everyone else is safe & secure in the rear. Maybe wars used to be fought like that, but those days are long gone. Things are not that cut-and-dried in the sandbox. That's why if you will look back at the "skid list" continually updated during the height of the war (2006 would be a good example) many casualties are truck drivers, cops, mechanics, aircraft maintenance workers, electronic equipment workers, medics, contractors, etc etc in addition to the typical "combat" jobs like pilots and aircraft crew members, infantry, artillery, tankers, etc.
Thank you both for your service. The point is, it's a part of your life, not your entire existence. Unlike some people , you don't post as if your military service was a suitable comeback to (deflection from) every possible argument in the RR.
and I think you overstate what qualifies as the concept of combat-along with your "unique" perspective...
If you're wearing your country's uniform and people from other countries are trying to kill you, that's combat.
perhaps... however, it was oldfella who got all triggered and personally singled out over REMFs in general vs someone like Marso. Not my fault he couldn't comprehend the analogies with performers vs roadies/stage crew... If you go back to page one you'll note that my original comment to him was directed at careerists and (those in private sector supply industries) who were against "socialism"-despite it having treated them fairly well. That the old lady doth protest so much likewise supports the notion that he exaggerates the harm's way he was (n)ever in.
You know, with a thread title that starts with "Duty", you'd think that perhaps the thread would be about some challenge we need to face, some hard decision that awaits us, perhaps even some sacrifice that needs to be made. No. It's about whom to hate. That's what "duty" means to these people: Put the blame for your fucked up life here.
"That's why if you will look back at the "skid list" continually updated during the height of the war (2006 would be a good example) many casualties are truck drivers, cops, mechanics, aircraft maintenance workers, electronic equipment workers, medics, contractors, etc etc in addition to the typical "combat" jobs like pilots and aircraft crew members, infantry, artillery, tankers, etc." - yours truly "and I think you overstate what qualifies as the concept of combat-along with your "unique" perspective..." spaceturkey and I think your "unique" perspective was never having served, let alone served in a combat zone, so this might give you a feel for it. Apparently the U.S. military agrees to disagree with your assessment. Better call the government and tell them I was overpaid according to your calculations! BTW at one time I was technically authorized to wear any of three different combat patches (my company hopped around a bit and served with different commands) but my favorite was the 3/4 CAV patch (pictured) because they treated us better than our own command did, to the point of making us official lifelong CAV members! https://www.military.com/benefits/military-pay/special-pay/hostile-fire-and-imminent-danger-pay.html https://www.thebalancecareers.com/army-combat-patch-rules-when-and-how-to-wear-the-patch-3344579 anyway a "combat zone" in 2003 (and the related combat pay) would be Iraq, and Kuwait for example. But in Kuwait you didn't get "imminent danger pay". Cross the border into Iraq and you did. Weird but that's how it worked. In Kuwait you didn't have to carry a weapon around nearly everywhere you went (even in a hopefully secure area) but you had to in Iraq. Military/contractors still got killed in Kuwait, just not nearly as often. when I served you got Imminent Danger Pay for being in a "combat" zone at a set rate every month. You got "hostile fire pay" if you could prove (better have pictures and witness statements or injuries) you were in actual close up almost died attacks - but I don't think you could collect both at the same time, I can't remember. So if you were temporarily in Iraq (maybe a commander of a unit stationed in Germany visiting his deployed troops) and got attacked and survived no sense claiming hostile fire pay, because it paid the same amount as imminent danger pay which you got automatically just by entering Iraq anyway.
a lot of dancing to get to the actual point... "which you got automatically just by entering Iraq anyway". you maybe got within an hour or two drive of the stage... my hero. Do they give you a star for your good conduct or passed basic medal for that?
an hour or two? more like a minute or two. How long does it take for your truck convoy to get attacked or your AO to get mortared? Jesus you don't have a fucking clue about how shit was over there. That's not your fault of course - you don't know a lot of military people with relatively recent combat zone experience. Canada has a military (been involved with joint exercises with them) but they weren't knee deep in the sandbox in any numbers. These days it's not uncommon to see U.S. military officers and NCO's with five or six combat deployments under their belt. Basically their whole career was going back-and-forth there. Sadly PTSD and prosthetic legged/armed folks are pretty damn common of course. Yes you do get awards & ribbons for combat time but they generally don't mean much unless they are for "valor" or doing extraordinarily dangerous shit. And yes you get a ribbon for basic training which is because if you didn't make it through basic you wouldn't be in the army! Same with "good conduct" which is automatic. If your conduct wasn't good you'd be kicked the fuck out!
True enough... most of my friends who were/are in the CF and have been close up and in harm's way are from during GW v.1 or Yugo as infantry. Thankfully don't believe I know any of those shit stains from the UN Somalia mission (and their disgracing of our Airborne). Possibly met a few when I lived in Calgary, but that doesn't really count for anything. Likewise, aside from a few PTSD'd acquaintances who were in Afghanistan, the only guy I know to suffer a severe injury was an old schoolmate who was bombed by an American pilot in a friendly fire incident.
It's not either or. You need both. Capitalism needs to be regulated to bejeezus, or you get 19th century robber barons. And if the robber barons don't like that, fuck 'em, corporations exist at the pleasure of the government in the first place. BUT, some things work better private than state. BUT, not everything, and I know the billionaires want every industry, and every molecule of resources including the literal air we breathe to have a price tag, and every penny from that to be in private hands. I don't agree. They've proven they can't be trusted with that power. They're too fucking greedy, and too fucking cruel. Laissez-faire is as much bullshit as pure Communism.
He just wants a system where he doesn't have to get a job and can watch Ghostbusters: The Vagina Monologues all day
meh-I've got three and the only reason I can make ends meet (under half of my income on rent) is because my lease is over a decade old.
so what disgraceful things happened with your Airborne troops in Somalia? I can't think of anything scandalous, just dangerous like in Mogadishu for example. Funny one of my buds (now deceased) said the unit he was in were getting surrounded by hungry locals. As you know, warlords & criminals controlled the food pretty much. Anyway the bad guys would use these opportunities to attack because you can't just run unarmed hungry civilians over - so you are pretty much creeping along. So the shit hit the fan and my buddy's convoy hauled ass regardless of the crowd. Murphy's Law took a big chuck out of my buddy's ass by having his HUMVEE hood pop the fuck open right then & there! So here he is with his vision blocked by his hood and no way he can pull over to put it back down - he'd get separated & isolated if he couldn't keep up! So he leaned out the window as best he could swerving and dodging folks & obstacles trying to keep up. Luckily they soon got away to an area where they could take a breather and pull over and regroup and assess the situation. Everybody but my buddy thought the whole thing was hilarious of course.
been 25 years, so forgive my jsut directing you to the wiki page. TLR though- shot a couple of civilians after basically baiting them. I think the lynchpin was the torture and murder of another civvie which in turn was found to be an institutional/leadership failure, along with other problems in discipline, resulting in the reg't being disbanded. Around the same time there were concerns over "hazing" which as memory serves resulted in the deaths of a couple of guys. Our Airborne was a composite (is that the term?) and thus considered a prestige assignment (sort of like our JTF2 now is) which was perhaps part of the hazing problem. In any event, public confidence in the CF took a major blow on top of concerns that had built up or otherwise accumulated during the government of the time (starting with cruise tests in the early 80s and ending with low level flight training over native lands)
Anybody catch the fact that @Marso used the motto of a band of space mercenaries in reference to the U.S. Military? I don't think that's fair at all.
