Game On in Iraq: Iranian Quds and Militias Suffer a, um, Setback

So fuck you for your proudest moment, because you didn't have to be there, you weren't a gullible child, you weren't fed a line a and you're revoltingly proud of yourself for being there.

That was your proudest moment, being a fucking criminal.

 

spot: here is a list of other wordforge members who have served in the U.S. military. It's not complete I'm sure, but this is off the top of my head. You claim my thought process is different than all the other soldiers you have met with.
Perhaps you are right! I've always been a bit of a misfit. My point being maybe you can ask the people on the list (guarantee one has more "trigger time" than I do) what they think about the U.S. going to war in the sandbox post 9-11. Get their thoughts (if they are willing to share them) on saluting flags, quitting the military if they get an assignment they don't like, and other related things under discussion.

ANC
SHIROGAYNE
MARSO
LANZMAN
MAN AFRAID OF HIS SHOES
VOLPONE

 

hmmm.....interesting diatribe mister spot. But I'm sensing some verrrry subtle negativity in your tone....

 

just a thought....my "proudest moment" is a tie between my son graduating college, my daughter getting married, and pretty much everything my beautiful grand daughters do. You were way, way off base.
Being a criminal (with a security clearance) is way down the list. Your mileage may vary!

 

Which every soldier did when they signed that contract and swore their oath.

Which doesn't have shit to do with the people that served.

It's not about having a fetish it's about having a sense of respect for people who made a decision to do a dangerous job that can cost them their lives. That might mean nothing to you, but it means a whole hell of a lot to me.

No one said that the soldiers were victims asshole.

And lefties wonder why they are branded as a group that hates the troops. This is why.

Which they get to deal with regardless of whether or not an outside military force is stationed there. Don't give me this bullshit that the middle east was some fucking paradise before the Iraq war. You had violence in Iraq long before Bush decided to stick a military force in there.

If the war had never happened, everything you are bitching about would still be happening.

And I'm glad that you didn't either. You wouldn't have made it out of boot camp.

I never did say that 9/11 had anything to do with Iraq you stupid fucking cunt. I said the reason many of those soldiers were serving already was BECAUSE of 9/11. Learn to read and comprehend English.

 

my hearing is kind of messed up (damn military radar!) but do I hear a school bell ringing?

 

Mine goes almost the same, although I do put graduating from Paris Island in my top five.

 

Seriously, I'm starting to wonder if spot's knowledge on the Iraq War all came from Fahrenheit 9/11.

 

There is a wide variety of thoughts about any given issue just on that short list which proves a point, but not necessarily tho one you intended. Here are some other names (not posters here that I know of): John McCain, George McGovern, Al Gore, Harry Truman. Of course there’s another point you’re making you may not realize: whilst you are so quick to accuse all “lefties” of hating the military you are doing exactly what you accuse them of.

 

Paris Island? Well that deserves a I'd be proud of that too! The Army gets a lot of "prior service" from other branches. Hell I was prior service air force myself. But some of the stories I heard from prior Marines......DAMN!
Those drills BRUTALIZED the shit out of those guys! One guy told me they had an obstacle course planned but bad weather put a layer of ice on many of the obstacles. But the drills made them run it anyway and a lot of guys got seriously injured! He himself got put out of boot camp (and the marines) from tearing his ligaments and tendons & whatnot. After about a year his leg healed up enough to get back in the military, but he said "not no, but hell no" to the marines - he learned his lesson. He joined the army where training is tough but safety and common sense is enforced somewhat better.

 

Just a Navy brat. Never served...unless you count the Tollhouse Incident of '05, but that was more of a delicious police action.

 

maybe I'm thinking of SHOOTER. But I could be wrong there too. For some reason I thought you were in the army.

 

Yeah, you're thinking of @shootER. I have trouble telling us apart too sometimes.

 

did I mention lefties? I don't think I did - let me check - nope, I didn't. My point is spot seemed to be saying military members suffer from "group think" because of the propaganda, motivational brainwashing type of things, when nothing could be further from the truth. Anyone who served know there is the way things seem to be on the surface (especially things civilians might see or hear) and the way things really are.

 

it's subliminal! Shooter = gun = your avatar! My mind got discombobulated - as if it were ever combobulated!

 

*whoosh*

 

Nope the "camera man" was never in the Army. He found a picture of someone in boot camp and pretended it was him.

 

No, you're thinking of Dinner. He was never in the army but liked to pretend he was.

 

I think you need to say that three times in front of a mirror for it to work.

 

I’m talking about this one time Dayton tried to say @shootER never served and challenged him to produce a picture of him in the Army so he did just that and Dayton still said he made it up, that he had just found a random picture on the internet. I saved the picture on my computer just in case it ever came up again. I’ll try and find the thread.

 

Found it
https://wordforge.net/index.php?thr...president-kitchens.116200/page-2#post-3069431

 

And I'm talking about the time that someone claimed Dinner was never in the military, and Dinner full-on lost his shit. You think that he freaked out over homeless people and immigrants, those are nothing compared to his reaction to someone saying he was lying when he said he was ex-military. Dude posted enough documentation (in between voluminous amounts of obscenities) that if someone wanted to steal his identity, they wouldn't have had too much trouble.

 

I’m not familiar with that one. Funny.

 

Yes, it pre-dates you by a few years. I'm not going to try and find it, because I wasn't kidding when I said he posted enough details that someone could easily steal his identity. He had a total meltdown and had to take a couple of months long vacation from the boards.

 

And they stop having it once the uniform is on? They become mindless drones who'll do whatever they're told?

Because that's the lesson learnt from the Hague, from Milgram, that it's hard to disobey an order but it's often the right thing to do.

Iraq was the wrong thing to do, from top to bottom.

It was your defence of the war and their participation, which would pretty much exonerate anyone who's fought in any war or committed any war crime. Every war is signed off by someone.

So yes it does have shit to do with the troops, because Congress passing of on a war in no way legitimises them being there.

Mostly, in this case, dangerous for other people who didn't get to choose. Did the people of Iraq get a say in the matter? Did anyone give them a purple heart if they were injured?

If t wasn't for them, what was the point? Why did they have to die and suffer? What "job" were those troops doing exactly?

Finding WMDs?

Yes they did, the entire premise of this exchange is to question the idea that planting IEDs or shooting US troops was "murder".

So yes, asshole, perhaps you should stop telling me to learn to read and consider the fact you've completely missed the point of the debate.

Whether they were victims is EXACTLY THE POINT.

Actually, it's more of a Brit thing, remember how NI was brought up earlier in the thread as being somehow a justification for Iraq? You guys did it too?

Well, that's the point, we've seen it close up, not on the news. When you talk to the average Brit we're going to relate more to the civilians than the troops because unlike you we've lived through something similar. Salute your flag all your flag all day and feel proud of the damage you've done on the other side of the planet but we've actually experienced the consequences.

Without having to put uniforms on.

You say the UK signed off on the war, I say Blair signed off on it and Parliament acquiesced. The public were adamantly against it, it was one the single most unifying issues of recent years amongst the public. Military parades were held by returning regiments where no one showed out, members of the armed forces stopped wearing their uniforms in public because of the abuse they took.

Was Iraq the shithole it is now beforehand?

Did ISIS exist?

Why did you invade? Why?

I know.

I'd have asked too many questions.

So why bring it up?

What bearing does it have?

It was used throughout the invasion as being key to public sympathy and very much as an excuse, let's cut the bullshit here.

Elements in the US had been itching to invade Iraq for years and 9/11 gave the impetus. It was easy to make the claim that the troops were there to combat terrorism and anyone who disagreed would be a terrorist sympathiser.

 

Any Iraqis on that list?

My argument, ironically, was in your defence. I made the case that doubtless you had faith in the military doing the right thing and you being there should be viewed through that lens.

Go back upthread and check, I was actually defending you at first. I also did a rare thing and got drunk and said things I shouldn't.

For that I apologise.

However yes, you do sense negativity on my part because we're still discussing American perspectives on something which is a Middle East issue. I get tired of hearing how we should treat ex military as heroes when all the prominent military activity of modern times has been at best misguided, at worst outright criminal. To my mind if there were any heroes they were heroes in spite of invading, not because of it.

I actually like you personally, unlike @Tererun, but I agree with her perception of you using your service as giving you credibility in debates. It tends to have the opposite effect when you are talking about decisions made in the political sphere because for much of the world (ie, not America) the Iraq war is seen as a source of shame, something which shouldn't have been allowed to happen and would have brought down the wrath of the international community had any other nation been the protagonist.

Yes you were just doing your job, but your employer was asking you to commit a crime and if that employer hadn't been the world's largest military machine there's every chance people who are currently wearing medals would be behind bars.

 

I know Diacanu tried to serve but got a medical discharge or something in basic - unfortunately that happens from time-to-time.

 

okay I perused the linked thread. That orthopedic shoe pic almost made me

 

I forgot about adding DINNER to the list of ex-military. That might have been who I got mixed up with MAOHS when it comes to serving.
Where is Dinner anyway?