Night Club Shooting in Orlando, FL

You can comfort yourself with that thought, but when the culture at large condemns a group of people, they become targets.

The New Orleans attack wasn't aimed at gays. As I recall the perp was pissed off because the door guy wouldn't let him in.

The "culture at large" is Muslim. The perp's father came from a country where homosexuality carries the death penalty.

But on the bright side, the perp also ranted about black people. He was just smart enough not to go to a rap or hip-hop venue and open up on them.

So you're telling me that these people in the nightclub were more of a target (an easier target) because they as a group are not accepted by everyone? Guess what, everyone didn't shoot up the joint - one person did. Are you saying that if gays were more accepted by the mainstream that there would have been better security? Please explain because I'm at a loss as to what you are trying to convey.

If gays were more accepted they would have had even less security at the club. Apparently the first shots were fired at the armed doorman or something of that sort.

His employer was G4S global security. His coworker complained to management that the guy was an unhinged racist homophobe who wanted to kill blacks and gays, but they wouldn't fire him because he was a Muslim.

No, not at all what I meant. I'll try again. When the message is broadcast that a certain group is despicable, the looney tunes among us will take action against that group. A person who condemns homosexual behavior might not personally take the next step. But if there are enough making that condemnation, they will be heard by somebody who is willing to carry that logic to conclusion. They are evil? Okay, they must be killed!

Or, you know, perhaps the Muslim extremist who swore allegiance to ISIS noticed how they keep making videos of gays getting thrown off buildings and then stoned again if they don't die immediately on impact.

But perhaps the deeper problem is within the Democrat party. The only Republicans involved in the shooting in any way were police and EMS responders horrified at what happened with a bunch of Democrats.

Careful there, you're making my point for me. You're supposed to be contrarian.

Well, if you insist on framing this politically, you should take a look at which party voted to not restrict terrorist gun purchases.

Ain't THAT the truth!

He wasn't a terrorist, he was employed by a global leader in security solutions. He probably could have gotten a job with Blackwater but they're probably more paranoid about Muslims that most other security firms, being politically incorrect and all.

What do you do when your policemen are jihadists by night? Do you have a quick fix for that?

At this point you kind of got to feel bad for the dead Jihadi. It must be so frustrating for him. He calls 911 says he is going to commit an act of Jihad by pledging allegiance to ISIS, and in the wake of his mass carnage, it's all about the guns.. Poor kid can't catch a break.

Where are you getting that he was such a badass? Could have been SWAT? Could have been Blackwater? What combat training did he have?

So bad/crazy/guys are that easily influenced? If they have no predisposition or inclination for hating gays but 10 percent of the general population don't like them - then they will jump on that bandwagon and take hate to the next level? So we better watch what we say because bad guys might be eavesdropping.
I know a lot of people who hate clowns - they are terrified of clowns - they would rather live in a clown-free world. Should they keep this to themselves before some crazy guy who also doesn't like clowns shoot up the circus? Sorry, not buying it. There is at the end of the day ONE PERSON responsible. ONE PERSON who pulled the trigger and acted on his twisted beliefs.

Mind you, those were just the mass shooting. Open gays got harassed and beaten and attacked on a regular basis, which is why the LGBT communities began springing up as safe havens. The Castro district of San Fran took off during WWII because those stationed on the West Coast who were processed out for being gay were dropped off there upon return from Japan and Guam. Obviously, there was far more disgrace with being openly gay seventy years ago and they didn't want to explain to their families why they'd been discharged in wartime. So you can thank the US Navy for that one

What I'm sure gul was trying to say is we don't need to kick up the proverbial hornet's nest. Yes, there are crazies who do crazy shit with no rhyme or reason, like Christina Grimmie's murderer. But when more and more gunmen have come out siting propaganda being their inspiration, whether it comes from ISIS, Faux News or Donald Trump's bleating about brown people....then yes, the media plays a part. Is it any surprise that a load of copycats sprung up after Columbine vying for the attention they needed so much?

Yeah, and our President's apathy towards homos sure didn't help to contain the disease. A whole lotta contaminated blood made it into hospitals and into sick patients like accident survivors and hemophiliacs because hey, this only affects gays and who gives a shit what sinners do?

I believe the official police term was "NHI" which stands for "No Humans Involved."

One Christian pastor's take on the shooting.

More, including video, at the link.

I was actually coming to post that, actually.

Classy chap, that guy.

There is nothing in that link to indicate the arson targeted for homosexuals specifically.

For all we know the arsonist had a business dispute with the bar owner.

That's the common theme amongst pretty much all of you morons on the left here. It's always someone else's fault, apathy, responsibility or creation of circumstance to blame. It would be funny were it not so pathetic.

Typical anti Reagan BS.

AIDS didn't even have a name until years into Reagan's presidency.

There isn't a shred of evidence that the Reagan admin. could've done a thing to control or reduce the spread of AIDS.

I suppose you didn't know that the Reagans had guests in the White House who they knew were homosexuals?

Except for that fact that, yanno, it's true.
The number of AIDS cases jumped from 600 in 1982 to over 5,000 in two years. Reagan wouldn't even address the issue nationally until 1985. There ain't no way there were that many gays humping each other that often, even in the coke filled 1980s.

A lot of innocent kids died from contact with contaminated blood that even the CDC figured out may have been an issue as early as 83.

So no, fuckwad, it wasn't all gay buttsecks. A good chunk of that was literally bad blood and our government was willing to ignore because it affected the wrong people. Enterprise even did an entire show about this.

He killed 50 people in a bar fight and put 53 more in the hospital.

Just because something made it on to an episode of a dreadful science fiction series means nothing.

And lets see. The U.S. had around 220 million plus people in the early 1980s.

Assuming around 1% of them were homosexuals (possibly a low figure but work with me as you have to disregard children)

That means a minimum of 2.2 million homosexuals.

Out of 2.2 million I find it perfectly reasonable that 5,000 could in fact contract AIDS.

But yes, I do know some people got infected due to contaminated blood (and organ transplants for that matter) but in the U.S. the main transmission vector was always homosexual sex.

This guy isn't alone:

Actually, much more than one person is responsible, a whole organization and ideology is responsible, as ISIS has claimed responsibility and the vast majority of muslims do support killing all gays.

there were 24 trans people murdered in the U.S last year, and IIRC trans people make up roughly half of hate crime killings lately. That's not counting incidental deaths that are not identified as hate crimes. So it's a steady stream.

I see where oldfella is coming from in laying the blame specifically on the shooter, and even agree that it's a minority who despise LGB/T people enough to think they deserve a violent response (most of whom are of the "Internet Tough Guy" sort who won't ever actually do anything of that type) but such people happen to be louder and often have a bigger platform which gives them outsized influence.

If a unhinged person like this hears a voice of authority condone his intentions, even if said voice doesn't use the words "go and kill" - whether it be an Iman or a Christian talk show host - that voice CAN be the one that confirms his resolve. This was a multi-layered situation in which you can find a rationalization for a variety of political views, but I do believe at least one takeaway is that the folks calling bullshit on the Bryan Fischers and Kevin Swansons' of the world need to be just as loud and persistent as they are. Every bit as much as we call it what it is when an Islamist says similar things.

The gunman was praising the 9/11 attackers back in high school and even cheered when he heard the news. He obviously thought of himself more as an Afghan and a muslim than an American even if he was an anchor baby.

It was ham-fisted, horribly executed, and didn't make any sense in the greater context of the franchise, but yes, they did an episode on it.