So You're Hitler...

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by StarMan, Feb 9, 2008.

  1. StarMan

    StarMan Fresh Meat

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    Would you have invaded Russia when he did?
  2. K.

    K. Sober

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    "I said Prussia, you numbwits, Prussia! Not Russia!"

    -- Adolf on his deathbed
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  3. Paladin

    Paladin Overjoyed Man of Liberty

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    Obviously not. Invade a few months earlier and Moscow probably falls, driving the Soviet Union's government back beyond the Urals, leaving them with a fraction of their previous strength.
  4. Clyde

    Clyde Orange

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    I would've picked a better symbol than a swastika, nobody likes that logo. Had Hitler used the Nike swoosh instead Russia would've gone bankrupt buying Air Nazis.
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  5. 14thDoctor

    14thDoctor Oi

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    I'd have solidified my control over the rest of Europe, then built up my forces while waiting for communist Russia to implode from the pressure of trying to keep up with me.
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  6. enlisted person

    enlisted person Black Swan

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    Only certain parts of Russia, those with significant material value and close enough to be totally secured before winter.
  7. Darkening

    Darkening Guest

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    Thats what happened (Oil fields)
  8. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    Despite the horrific costs, it could be argued that some of the mistakes made during the invasion were as much of a problem as the timing of the invasion.

    On a more general point, Hitler hadn't intended to go to war before 1942-43 and then only on a limited scale.
  9. evenflow

    evenflow Lofty Administrator

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    I'd wait for the bomb, then give Stalin one hell of a tan.
  10. Demiurge

    Demiurge Goodbye and Hello, as always.

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    Hitler might have been OK if it wasn't for the Czech uprising, which delayed his plans a month or two.

    Certainly there was never a better time to invade Russia. Stalin was so hoodwinked by Hitler that he had his own best spy executed for telling him Germany was about to invade.

    The leadership corps was in shambles from the purges.

    The Red Army's morale was at an all time low.

    Two things make Germany's attack a success. Start in the spring, though that got screwed by the Czech uprising.

    And treat the citizens humanely. Hell, the Ukraine would have thrown a ticker tape period for Hitler as a liberator if he hadn't given the instructions to burn the fucking country to the ground and shoot anyone that resists. As it was, over a million Russians and Ukranians fought FOR the Germans because they hated Stalin so much.

    Of course, if Hitler had treated the citizens humanely, he wouldn't have been Hitler.

    Once the Czech uprising delays the plans, you hold off and consolidate Western Europe. Gives you another 6-9 months to try to get a negotiated peace with Great Britain.

    The Third Reich was in the perfect place to be the dominant European country in the world, and one of the 4 great powers, in 1940.

    Thank God Hitler fucked it up.
  11. ehrie

    ehrie 1000 threads against me

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    A lot of things had to come together for Barbarrosa to fail as it did. Even if the wrangling with OKH had been settled on the actual invasion plan the Spring Thaw in Russia came very late in 1941.The Germans would have had the mobility to exploit the dozens of hole in the Russian lines they blew open in the initial days if the roads were clogged with mud as they would have been if the invasion had taken plane in April or May. The biggest change I would have made was to concentrate on Army Group Center. Hitler's constant shuffling of the Panzer armies in AGC delayed their push to Moscow. Once the '42 blitz failed it was over, but I can't really see a problem with Operation Blue. If either Stalingrad or the oil fields near Baku fell the Soviets would have really been up against the wall. Von Paulus came oh so close to choking off Stalingrad as well.
  12. Demiurge

    Demiurge Goodbye and Hello, as always.

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    Baku was more important that Moscow. Moscow had fallen before in the Napeoleonic era and it wasn't the end of the Russian war effort.

    Oil was the pivotal resource. Moscow was important, but by then a good portion of the factories had been shipped East.

    The other thing Hitler should have done is not divided AG South on the push between Stalingrad and Baku. They could have taken Baku with Von Paulus's force included.

    Whether they could have kept it would have been another matter.
  13. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    I'm Hitler, eh?

    Well, I'd be too addled with syphilis and amphetamines to make many rational choices.
    I'd probably be so fucking crazy I'd invent nazis or something.
  14. ehrie

    ehrie 1000 threads against me

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    Moscow was vitally more important in 1941 than it was in Napolean's time. Army Group Center had so throughly stomped the three Soviet Fronts(Soviets called their Armies Fronts for some god forsaken reason) that if Hitler had not taken his Panzers to the North for a drive on Leningrad AGC could have gotten to the doorstep before most of the Industrial Evacuation had been done. Even in December, 41, a huge amount of very precious industry would have been lost if Moscow had fallen not to mention prestige. The moral of the Soviets by then was in the toilet already after so completly dominated by the Huns.
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