The Orville [SPOILERS WITHIN]

you hear a lot of people bash Disco for what they would call "virtue signaling" (which is a basically bullshit complaint) when it's VERY obvious that's what The Orville is doing (and quite well, I applaud it). Like the one about the kid, this was a very obvious allegory for modern "sexual politics" - the Mochalns are basically the Tony Perkins AFA/ADF crowd, LOCAR an LGBT analog, and Klyden a legalistic Pharisee tight-ass.

They were saying something big when they speculated how long a civilized union could keep putting up with such a group as the Moclans and the scene where Tallia tells off Klyden is (besides being well played) was deliberately the emotional climax of the episode.

But even though some critics would criticize it for being too heavy-handed, that to me is what makes it powerful.
I wonder if One Million Moms knows they just took a broadside without responding?

I interpreted it much broader than that, and saw it as a direct shot across the bow of countries of Saudi Arabia, etc. that have institutionalized mysogyny and homophobia.

Not sure how you can see it any other way when Mercer says the Union needs the Moclans for now, but then asks: "how long can an alliance with a culture like that last?"

It started out as a fairly run-of-the-mill episode but became very powerful and didn't hold any punches, particularly when Keyali tells Klyden to go to hell. Trek in any of its forms never would have gone that far.

Glitch in the Matrix.

Good episode. Thoughts and random observations ...

The moral dilemma: Definitely a comment about our relationships with countries like Saudi Arabia in which we need them, but their human rights policies are atrocious. But in-universe, it raises the questions of what type of body the Union is, and how easy it is to join. It seems to be a looser federation than the United States or Canada, but tighter than the European Union (for instance, there's a unified military, but member worlds also still have their own ships, although I guess you could argue that's analogous to National Guard units in the U.S. being under state command until federalized). In our universe, Turkey's entry into the EU has been stalled by human rights concerns, and here we have a full member state in a much tighter union whose civil rights policies are more like Saudi Arabia's or Iran's. Plus a lot of their abuses seem to come as a surprise to Mercer. How carefully does the Union screen new members? Was there something behind the scenes (maybe related to Kelly's "we need them" comment) that caused Union leadership to look the other way and hide information from Union citizens? This could lead to some really interesting episodes later on.

The mystery: Well done. Reminds me more of an episode of NCIS or Law & Order than the half-assed stuff that Trek usually does for its obligatory murder mystery episodes.

Simulator privacy protocols: Either they seriously suck, or Orville officers regularly engage in egregious abuses of power. Cops can get fired if they do something like run a name through NCIC for personal reasons, and Orville officers can just barge in on anyone's simulation without permission? Yes, it's military, but Keyali's reaction to Locar being in her quarters suggests that there's an expectation of privacy in crewmembers' personal spaces.

Kelly has an office: This just registered for me. Like on TNG and Voyager, the first officer seems to have a lot of administrative duties -- more than the captain -- and essentially be in charge of human resources. Riker had to go to Ten Forward to discuss crew evaluations with Troi. It was like having your company's HR director hold confidential meetings at a Starbucks.

Almost missed it: Keyali has the simulator replay from Time Index 1701.7.

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In regards to the Moral Dilemma, this is straight out of Star Trek. Vulcan is a founding member of the Federation and Spock has been Kirks best friend for years. Yet there are obviously whole sections of Vulcan history and culture that Kirk is completely ignorant of. Likewise in Star Trek member planets still maintain their own militaries if they wish.

The Mystery-agreed.
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Simulator privacy protocols- also straight out of Star Trek. In Star Trek there is no expectation of privacy on the holodeck either. Apparently if you run a holodeck program you were effectively giving anyone and everyone permission to look into it if you wished. ​

Finally caught up. This episode was again, better than Discovery. I felt like this was a dig against Saudi Arabia which I'm glad they had the guts to say it. This was very much a Star Trek episode that has a morality tale, but on Discovery you don't have that, you just have a show off of VFX that doesn't really serve the story. Then we have the section 31 BS that doesn't work and shouldn't even be there. This proves that the story arcs aren't necessary. I knew Kelly's relationship wasn't going to last and I'm glad, I didn't really like him. The jokes were good as well, especially the fake "oh no" from Mercer. Nice title Easter egg with the timestamp at 1701. Overall, this was a pretty good episode and this show really blows Discovery away.

I don't see the Moclans as part of the Union. I think they are allied with the Union and Moclans are allowed to serve in the Union if they want.

The Union seems to be primarily a human thing.

We really need some more info on the Union and just what it is politically.

Alara did a pretty good job keeping people out of the simulator last season.

Perhaps you need to lock the door.

Riker has an office.

They all have an office it's just for budget reasons we never saw it. We saw Crushers office because it was part of the Sickbay set. We saw Data's office which was part of his quarters.

In "About a Girl," Mercer says "your planet is a member of the Union" to Bortus.

The Orville wiki claims that "Union worlds abolish national governments in favor of membership," but offhand I don't know if there's a source for that in an episode or if somebody just made it up. (The Orville wiki isn't the worst of the Fandom.com wikis by a long shot, but it's also no Memory Alpha...)

Maybe it's a new member and in the process of converting over.

Didn’t Bones have an office that was also a part of sickbay?

I now am imagining Star Trek: The Office.

Yes.

Since sickbay is a big part of TOS and TNG the office was built into the set.

I’m pretty sure we saw both on screen briefly. It may have even been seen whe Polaski was the Doctor.

We saw both offices.

Thought so.

"offices" exist in The Orville and in Star Trek for the same reason in most Star Treks it took a long walk to get from the bridge (or anywhere else) to the transporter rather than having transporter pads next to the bridge or simply in the later series using site-to-site transport. In other words such features are the way they are to give the characters time to interact and provide expository dialogue.

Any idea why they've been doing the "presented with limited commercials" thing?

I wonder if there's starting to be a market among advertisers who are willing to pay a premium to be in a much shorter commercial block than normal.

Damn ... that was good.

Up until now the show been mostly "it's good fun, and that's all I really expect from it, which is fine." But this episode was a big step up.

Holy shit, this show just got real.

Great episode, spoilers below

dang, forgot how to wrap spoiler tags around text.
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So do it the hard way.

I figure there is one of only two ways they can write their way out of this. One way (and what I fear Seth McFarland does ) will go for is the "Star Trek" type of ending. Isaac is moved by his love for the doctor and her children to betray his people, saving the Orville crew (and Earth) but becoming yet another "alien in exile" like Worf was in TNG.

Or they could go full bore dark. The Orville crew is forced to destroy Isaac to save themselves and Earth with the doctor herself the instrument of his destruction. That said I would go with this option. Or at least the crew saving Earth but forcing Isaac and his people to leave. Either way it would emphasize the theme of there being a cost associated with winnin.

Honestly don’t know where they’re going to go with this, but damn that was a hell of an episode.

Holy Shirtballs!

Holy shit! So when they entered the planet I noticed two things, it has an Earth like atmosphere and they all look humanoid. That almost always means they were build by a humanoid society or evolved from a humanoid society. I assumed they had evolved. Then when shit started getting weird, I figured they saw humans as a threat. Then the bones showed up and I figured they used biological lifeforms like the Matrix robots. Turns out they went The Terminator route. I'm guessing Isaac will save them and is simply going along for now. His relationship with Dr. Finn and his experience on the Orville will convince him that biological lifeforms are worthy of saving.

Oh and, large spheres that destroy civilizations, where have I seen that before?

That would be the "Star Trekkian" route. But I have a feeling that if they do try something like that it will be at some cost to Isaac and the doctor. Say all of Isaac's experiences and memories while being aboard the Orville end up being erased meaning he has no memory of the doctor, her sons, or his relationship with them.

That said, to me Mercer after noting that the Kalon were apparently building new weapons systems and finding out about the massive tombs under the surface should've hotfooted it back to the Orville and hauled ass as fast as they could!! Not "demand an explanation". Especially given that Mercer admitted to Kelly already that "something isn't quite right".

I’m guessing Mercer has a plan, but yeah, they should have got the hell out of Dodge and informed the Union.

It’s more Terminator than Trek, the Borg assimilated people. Skynet saw humanity as a threat and destroyed them. I guess it’s a little of both because the Kalyn’s need to expand to Earth.

The thing to me would be this: Let's say they go the "Star Trekkian" route and Isaac turns on his own people and saves the crew of the Orville (and all of humanity for that matter)….his entire time aboard the Orville now has to be seen by the crew in a very sinister light. He wasn't merely "gathering knowledge". He was gathering information to determine whether humans should be exterminated or not! A genocide scout!

Even if he changes sides and saves all of humanity the Orville crew should wait for the right time (sooner rather than later) and chop him into very small pieces. They can then examine him for whatever technology the Kalon have.

The only way I think they can create a scenario where Isaac goes back to "as before" is if it turns out Isaac agreed to join the crew of the Orville FROM THE BEGINNING hoping to obtain the knowledge that would spare humanity.

At any rate no matter how you cut it, forget the extremely conventional Krill, the Union has just acquired a horrendously powerful and dangerous new enemy.

If Mercer was going to tell his crew to stand down anyway, why didn't he do that immediately before 20-30 of them were gunned down by the Kalon boarding party? And for that matter if the Kalon are supposedly so reluctant to kill as Isaac indicated about the genocide of their creators, then why didn't they demand Mercer order the Orville crew to surrender instead of going in shooting?

Seems to me that the Kalon know a great deal about "successful coercion through terror".

Perhaps they'll use this opportunity to get rid of the repulsive Klyden.

Seems to me though this is the point where Seth MacFarland is basically saying "Screw this doing a Star Trek parody thing! I'm going full on 'In the Pale Moonlight' here!!"

There is yet another route MacFarland could go that would be a total wimp out.

Have the entire situation from the underground tombs full of bodies through the takeover of the Orville and Kalon attack on Earth be a simply sophisticated simulation prepared by the Kalon. A test to see how humans will react to their impending doom. Of course humans pass, the Kalon join the Union and all is right with the world again.

I’m guessing we’ll get answers to all of that next week.

Short of everything after the porno virus episode being in the simulator, I don't see how they can put the "Isaac and the Kalon are evil", genie back in the bottle.
This will be interesting.

Agreed. Even if Isaac acts supremely heroically and rescues the Orville crew and all of humanity how can Captain Mercer overlook 20-30 members of his crew being mowed down like that?