What circumstances do you imagine would make it impossible for someone to obtain a photo ID? Take your time. You get points for not trotting out the old "Millions of illegals are voting!" canard. Guess aligning yourself with Donnie-boy on that lie was a nonstarter.
I never sign my name the same way either and my hands are fine. Plus I just prefer the experience of walking in, talking to the poll workers and getting my sticker. I like the social interactions with other people who are waving signs or in the parking lot. You don't get that with mail in voting. Plus, thanks to all the options we have with VBM and the numerous Early Voting locations, lines are nothing. Not sure why that puts such a bug up some people's asses around here.
Until they give out state ID for free at least a year in advance of the election, you can go fuck yourself. Personally, I actually think free state issued driver or non-driver ID for everyone should be done. It would help with so many things, but right now it is a great way for the state to keep down the people who do not have it. It should also be that those with a suspended driver privilege should not have their ability to vote or identify themselves taken away by their permission to drive being suspended or revoked. If you have the picture ID from the state, then it should count for voting. I would also like to say that I have seen some states (i am looking at you South Carolina) that have cops sit in the DMV to arrest people should be told to go fuck themselves if we are to rely on state issued ID. There is just something very racist about having racist cops watching things like voting to harass people.
Look at what ICE does. Let us say you are hispanic and you need an ID. However, ICE is looking over the counter at the people applying for ID waiting for a hispanic person to show up and ask for a multilingual DMV agent? With the way ICE can just drag you away without warrant, charges, or even suspicion you might be a little worried to wander in to get ID. I know some states have the local PD sitting there looking for people. I watched them pull people off line in SC for showing up to the DMV. What is to stop them from setting up cops to pull people from the voting line when they scan their state ID? What is to stop them from flagging names who are hispanic? I am just saying I can not blame people for not wanting an ID when the ID system itself is used to flag people the state does not like. It is one thing if you are pulled over and checked, but it is another when there is no probable cause to be checking IDs for things like warrants and whether or not you are hispanic at the voting booth. The rule should be that police cannot run your ID if they have no investigation or reason to do so.
Ah-HA I have activated your trap card! Only I haven't. Wasn't me who brought up those who can't get I.D. I was just playing along. Ask Jenee about the magical invisible people that at least I don't have the knowledge to speak about. All I've said is that I don't really trust my local post carrier with my ballot and I am going to my polling place to vote. It is quite odd. And the opposition has come from the more extreme posters here. I'm going to observe social distancing, wear a mask. I have plenty of hand sanitizer. Whats the problem?
For me personally, I'm in a solidly red district. I want to look everybody in the eye when I vote straight Democrat (for the first time in my life).
People TheBurgerKing would disenfranchise: The blind The disabled Epileptics Severe diabetics People with certain heart conditions All perfectly mentally fit. All unable to obtain a driving licence. All "invisible" because he didn't engage his brain for five fucking seconds.
Every state offers an official state ID card that is a non-driver ID. Every one of those people is able to get one. It makes getting a job and applying for government benefits much easier.
I’m seriously trying to understand your point. Your first post seemed to indicate people were either intellectually incapable of obtaining a drivers license or they were intentionally defying ... something presumably an act civil disobedience. Im asking you you help us understand to whom are you referring.
Sometimes, the same thing preventing someone from obtaining a drivers license are the same things preventing them from obtaining a state ID.
Some of those conditions prevent you from getting a driver's license outright, but if you had the paperwork and fees for the license you could get a state ID. Difficulties in getting that paperwork might be inherent in one's condition, especially if poor, but are more of an indirect result of the condition rather than an actual restriction keeping you from getting a license or ID. For instance a blind person may have trouble researching and finding things like a BC if lost, but they are not getting a DL even if they had one. I also do support an increase in human helping hands for disabled people provided by the government in order to make things like voting and obtaining ID easier. We have a lot of people out of work even in non-covid times. We could really be assisting people to live much more if we just taxed the wealthy and put people to work on things.
Ok, A) I agree that there is a lot that those who can, can do to help those who can't. B) ... and, this may entirely be a product of my childhood, but .. no American should be forced to obtain an ID. If they don't want one, they shouldn't be forced to obtain one. And I also think that should not prevent anyone from voting. How is that solved? Same way it was solved 250 years ago. Not everyone had ID then, but they had the right to vote. Yes, there are more people today than 250 years ago and not everyone knows everybody else. But ..., I just think that is part of being American. We don't HAVE to do any of those things.
I would have to disagree with our present state of things. 100 years ago there was not a purpose for everyone to have ID, but you could also go out and hunt and live off the land if you wanted to. Now society is everywhere for many people. If you want to live in a place like america with the things america has, then you need ID to contribute to the goings on of america because it simply does not happen on it's own. With the expansion of societies on many continent there is far less space for the person who hunts and farms their own food and survival. If you are going to live off the work of a society of others, as americans pretty much do, then you identify yourself for certain things. If you want to vote for that society, then you identify yourself as part of that society. If you are not interested in identifying yourself as part of that society, then you should not be voting for what that society does. If I did not like america and wanted to be a part of another society I would apply to be a part of a different society as per their laws. Don't blame me for that reality as I neither created this place, or would have created this specific place. I am just saying the society of the US is a lot easier to navigate and get stuff in when you have ID due to the laws and restrictions created by it's people. Since voting is restrictive to location and individual status, they have to have some way of confirming you are a resident with status to vote. That just seems like a logical conclusion to me.
I agree completely. My point is that it isn't required. One can move to the mountains or some other ... remote area, claim land as a homesteader, grow their own food, collect their own water, etc., but that should not prevent them from every four years wandering down the mountain to cast a vote.
One of the problems I see with that is that even though that person may not be using their identity others look for that opening. It is not something I am proud of, and I say that because if you mention something around here you are bragging, but I am a convicted identity thief. When I was doing the research into how the crime was done people were always looking for someone not using their identity who would not notice right away. It used to be a lot easier to do, but there is not a lot of verification today. I am actually shocked there is not more voter fraud, but I guess criminals think votes are useless. that is why stupid politicians are often caught doing it. However, here in america if you are born a citizen your identity has value to so many people in many different ways. A person wanting to live away from people should really be sure to watch their identity because hermits are easier targets. Not establishing a hold on your ID allows another to do it. The banks like activity, and when the money is gone they find it much easier to go after the victim than the thief for compensation. The government goes after the thief, but the bank only wants money and that comes from holding the victim hostage because the ID thief is much better at living off the grid.
Ok. Interesting. I didn't know all that. But, also has nothing to do with the fact that an ID is not required.
No, I spoke in generalities to some whataboutism that I was asked when I said I supported voter ID. You came REEEEEEEEing in with some argument about me not understanding some demographic I "have no experience or knowledge of" as what? Some shutdown tactic? Bait trying to get me to say something you disagree with so you can lable me as an -ist or -phobe to justify to yourself unpersoning me?
Jeez, could you bitch more? Maybe don't say stupid shit in the first place? Maybe, if you spoke in a generality and someone took it the wrong way, admit you made a mistake? Rather than jump to "magic invisible people"?
Ok. First, you're being a dick and you know it. Second, this is the post to which I was questioning. Specifically this part Emphasis mine. You've already discounted people with disabilities and people who can't afford licensing fees. I only questioned who it is you think are "just unwilling". However, if it's too much for you to answer, just say so. Or just say you misspoke. Or anything. There is absolutely no reason for you to be a dick from any of the questions I asked you.
So I should apologize because someone is trying to bait me? Nah. Jenee is just trying to force me to define something so she can nitpick something to take offense of. She isn't interested in discussing the issue, she's just looking for ways to act smug and superior.
I think you have me confused with another poster. I do not attempt to play word games in order to confuse or undermine anyone. I asked a simple question. If you can't answer it, just say so.
I used to enjoy voting in person, at least for Presidential elections (vote-by-mail for the rest), but they kept changing my polling place. The first one was in a church hall half a block away from my house; the lines were short, indoors (important for someone as melanin-challenged as I am), and the poll workers were friendly. In 2008 the polling place was the temple around the block from me. Gorgeous place, marble floors, air-conditioned (a rarity in Santa Monica because the weather used to be milder than it has been in recent years). There was also the entertainment value of standing in line behind a mother and daughter - it was the daughter's first time to vote, and she was literally jumping up and down with excitement. Fast forward to 2012: the polling place was the cafeteria in the basement of an assisted-living facility. It was crowded and noisy and the line was backed up to the top of the stairs (and God knows how the residents got their meals that day), but at least I could still wait inside. Fast forward to 2016: Same basement venue, but the line stretched outside and around the corner... in blazing sunlight. Hadn't thought to bring my parasol, wondered what would happen if I passed out from heat-stroke. (Yes, in this part of the world it's often hotter in November than it is in July). After that I decided to vote entirely by mail. I cannot imagine what it must be like for people in Red states where in-person polling places have been disappearing to have to wait in line in all weathers for hours just to exercise their franchise. That's not to mention WTF Election Day has to be on a weekday, which is a hardship for working people.
I do like voting in person. There's just something about participating in the process on election day. But, thank Goddess I ordered the absentee ballot. Cuz, due to finding out about the teenager's positive test result and subsequent quarantine, I would not have had time to request one, receive it in the mail, then return it in time.
I enjoy voting in person as well. Here in Boise, after you turn in your ballot the poll watcher asks your name and whilst handing you your "I Voted" sticker announces to everyone [your name] has voted! Hopefully I'll get to vote by mail/absentee, not that it will make much difference in the overall scheme of things since Idaho is so firmly entrenched in Trump's camp, but ce'st la vie.
I think there is a big difference in using ID to make it easier to navigate society, and requiring ID in order to vote.
I will be voting in person this year even though my state offers no questions asked mail in voting. I have big concerns about the people that Trump has put in office to manage the USPS.
I'd be fine with a voter ID law with these conditions: 1) As you describe, state-issued photo IDs being completely free (otherwise it is a poll tax). 2) Some kind of requirement for Secretary of State/DMV locations that ensures Republican-run states can't just close every location for getting a photo ID that's located in a majority-Black neighborhood. (I don't know exactly what this would look like, but it seems like we could come up with a formula that takes into account population, proximity, and available hours, to guarantee that everyone has a location within X miles of their residence, that a single understaffed location isn't trying to serve a quarter-million people, and that hours are reasonable.)
My mother is a very intelligent person. Scholarship to Vanderbilt, Masters Degree, co-founder/owner of a telecommunications company w/over 100 employees, etc. I say that not to brag, but to give context for the below. A few years ago Alabama decided to pass that ALEC asshole anti-immigrant bill. It didn't last. Took one failed harvest season and a Toyota Senior Engineer and the VP of Mercedes Benz spending nights in jail b/c they were travelling without their papers and then the law was gutted. Anyway, didn't last but still wreaked havoc. My family had a farmhand Clint that worked for us since the 80s. He can't read or write so no DL. Someone would pick him up and drop him off and he rode a fourwheeler during the day. Anyway he doesn't have a birth certificate. In fact doesn't even know his exact birthday. To make matters worse, he was from Wilcox county, which is about as Boonie as you can get. No records. Under the new law, he couldn't prove he was a US Citizen and my family couldn't employ him. My mother spent MONTHS trying to navigate the system and get Clint legalized. Eventually gave up and just paid cash. America!
