Considerations...

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by Marso, Aug 6, 2019.

  1. Lanzman

    Lanzman Vast, Cool and Unsympathetic Formerly Important

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    It worked pretty much as designed, yeah. Which result is why the US isn't a "pure" democracy, but a Republic with strong democratic flavors. The founders were horrified, and rightly so, at the idea of direct democracy.
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  2. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Yes, it worked exactly as designed, the person who got the most electoral votes won.
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  3. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    I am always at risk of dying because I can't afford insulin.
    I live in a home that is rented, and if I miss a payment I can be kicked out.
    I have to eat what food I can afford, and it's usually filled with high levels of salt, fat, and carbohydrates because cheap fillers are easy to produce, cost little and make a bigger profit for the people at the top.
    I take care of family who cannot afford the medical care necessary for them to live without major assistance, consuming years of my life just to keep them alive.
    I live in a neighborhood with a high crime rate, where two people were shot just a few weeks ago over a bad drug deal.
    I have lived in a shack on a hill without water or power.
    I have been homeless. I've lived in tents, in cars, sleeping in people's back yards.
    I have been without food for days at a time, and even when I had food it would be something simple like a piece of bread and some mustard I could get from a take out restaurant.
    I used to go to school without any lunch money, and one of my friends, who was also poor, would pool his money with what I could find and we'd share a pretzel or a can of pop.
    Our heat has been turned off in the dead of winter because we couldn't afford the bill. No mercy on the part of the electric company. We just couldn't pay their price to keep us warm.
    Our water was shut off because it became too expensive to pay. Water's not a human right, you know.

    I guarantee that I've worked harder than you ever will.

    So you can fuck right off with that bullshit.

    Fuck. Right. Off. with it.

    They are. What the fuck do you know? You know numbers. You know how to turn human beings into commodities. You know how to buy and sell people as a way of increasing your personal profit at their expense. You know how to exploit, that's what you know, and for people like you there's no way you want this to end.

    Imagine being so much a slave to your lord and master, you're willing to let people die in agony because you get a nice house, and a nice car out of the deal. All it cost you was your soul, which you clearly weren't using. All you have to do is pretend everything is going great. If this were the 1800s, you'd be telling me how civilized we are, and how everyone's doing well, yes, everyone that matters. Black people free? Don't be absurd, that's a fantasy world!

    Our whole wonderful civilization that you exalt is built upon their corpses, and you are fine with that. At the very least, slaves of the 1800s in Canada, in the U.S., most knew they were slaves. People are still slaves today, but they think if they work really hard, they'll become millionaires, and you would be happy to lead them on if it means a steady paycheck for you. Teasing a desperate mother who just wants to feed, clothe, and house her children? Making promises that she can have it if she just works a little harder. Keep showing her the dream. She'll never reach it, but you profit from her desperation. She'll work longer and harder, toiling her life away on a promise that you never intend to keep, because when she finally reaches the point where she can do no more, you will make her feel like the one whose hat is in hand when she comes to collect what is rightfully hers, and you will whisk it away from under her, and find someone who will do it faster and work cheaper.

    The earth is heating up, millions of people are at risk of dying from what's coming, and the children who made your clothing, the ones who are paid pennies a day and piss themselves because they can't stop long enough to take a bathroom break. We cannot sustain this so-called "civilization" you crow about. Too many people have to suffer and die so that you can feel comfortable.

    I'm not the "cunt" here, sir.

    Oh knock it off, Dayton Lite. You don't even know what the fuck is going on. You're just a dog yapping at its master's heels, hoping for scraps of approval, you wank.
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  4. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Businesses go out of business don't they?
  5. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Do you think they might revise their opinion of a nation where the Senate leader can unilaterally kill all bills passed by the House, States can gerrymander to negate votes they don't like, and the President can appropriate funds willy-nilly as long as he declares an emergency and has the AG in his pocket? Oh, and attempts at oversight are blocked because of said Senate and AG?
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  6. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Ask Trump. He's been bankrupt so many times that, if he were you or I, he'd be on the streets.

    The ones taking advantage of your "sweat of my brow" BS aren't the ones who ever pay when they fail. Curious, that.
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  7. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I'm pretty sure they knew that could happen, but hoped people weren't stupid enough to allow it.
  8. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Shouldn't have chosen a bunch of Puritan fuckwits who ran from their own nations because of oppression when said oppression was that they weren't allowed to be hateful enough, then.

    I mean, what the fuck did they expect to happen? It's like locking Batman and the Joker in a cell and not betting on fractures.
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  9. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Shouldn’t have raised taxes on our tea, we really like our tea.
  10. Ten Lubak

    Ten Lubak Salty Dog

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    Sounds like you have a very accurate grasp of what's happening to you, sure. But not the world, definitely not

    A lot more than you it would seem

    You're just completely off your rocker if you think most people are subject to the worst examples of what is happening right now

    Most people are happy with their lot in life. They aren't millionaires, they aren't stepping all over the the masses, they're just normal people with great families that make decent money and enjoy themselves.. They probably don't post on message boards either

    This is all just overly dramatic garbage that has no root in reality

    Maybe the stress you get from your daily life you describe above is affecting you to accurately see what is happening in the world today - which is totally understandable - but you are so far off the mark here bud, I don't know what to tell ya
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  11. Ten Lubak

    Ten Lubak Salty Dog

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    :dayton:

    The Left truly is the most joyless part of the political spectrum
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  12. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    You only consider it overly dramatic garbage because that's how you see people, and only those who speak up rather than suffer in silence. Their suffering isn't your concern, only their exploitation for your own gain. You don't believe what I've said is reality, and you insist I live in a fantasy world. All I can do is hope you experience the reality you so truly believe doesn't exist. Maybe then you'll know what it's like to be the coal that fuels the capital machine you worship.
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  13. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    I'm going to posit that you're in your own bubble. I make $66k a year equivalent and am single, own my own home and am sipping some nice single malt right now. But I know plenty of folk at my workplace who earn far less than they are worth for the work they do, are living paycheck to paycheck, and are accessing benefits to make do. One of them, I would happily take a 10% pay cut for if it meant keeping her on (we have a bunch of redundancies coming) because she literally keeps my lab running so I'm free to do the academic shit they think is worth that $66k.

    Sadly, I don't get to make that call.
  14. Ten Lubak

    Ten Lubak Salty Dog

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    I love how you take issue with my relatively benign statement that a lot of people are happy with their lot in life and not @Amaris ' ludicrous assertion that everyone is miserable and the status quo is that most people are subject to the worst examples that life has to offer

    Tells us where your head's at
  15. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    What's your address?

    So I can send some flowers to your mother after Starbucks are finished with you.

    I'm sure the fact that your libertarian ideals enabled the rise of the corporation that brutally murdered you for disrespecting coffee will soothe her grief, but the flowers are a nice touch anyway.

    Considering she won't get an open casket funeral unless she's planning to hold it at a Lovecraft convention.
  16. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    In the UK about to be faced with no-deal Brexit.

    I'm still British enough to ask where your fucking full stops are at. CUNT.
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  17. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    :sob: Communism hasn’t killed enough people :sob: It’ll work, I promise!:whaa:
  18. Ten Lubak

    Ten Lubak Salty Dog

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    Sounds like you're on your period
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  19. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    You should be asking yourself why capitalism has killed a shitton of folk and convinced you it's worth it.
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  20. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Americans only call the full stop a period because it's the point at which they want you to carry out a new sentence.
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  21. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    You should be thankful that you live in a mostly capitalist society and not in a shithole like North Korea.
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  22. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    I could live in Paradise except for being shat on twice a day, and I'd still have the right to complain about the shit.

    Are YOU planning on keeping quiet if a Dem wins the next election, despite the fact America is still the most corporate-friendly, gun-friendly, Christian-friendly, asshole-friendly nation on the planet?

    No, of course you fucking aren't.

    So fuck off with that bullshit.
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  23. Marso

    Marso High speed, low drag.

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    One reason conservatives are so happy and Leftists are so miserable is that capitalists need friends. They need business partners and investors, trading partners and customers so satisfied they come back again and again.

    The socialist needs enemies. There must be people who hate him and oppress him. If he's not hated and oppressed then socialism doesn't exist.

    If he can't find any such hatred, he's forced to make it up. "Dog whistles" - he knows what you're REALLY saying -- and "micro-aggressions" are all invented nonsense because this "oppression" simply MUST be true or else there's no socialist movement (and no free things.)

    The socialist doesn't need to work well with others because he doesn't work. What he needs is an excuse to justify his theft. -Sayet
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  24. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    You first.
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  25. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Or folk you have over a barrel so they have no choice.

    Obama was a decent guy, but even HIS former trade advisor was telling it how it is regarding a possible US-UK trade deal the other day:

    You've bought into the Libertarian bullshit harder than FF, which I thought was impossible since he's mainlining the stuff. "Enlightened self-interest" falls apart as soon as one party knows it can fuck the other over and get off scot-free because it bought the judge and the cops. And because the proles can't shop anywhere else.

    Until we evolve to be better than that, regulation of business is the way to go, but they have you brainwashed into thinking that's socialism and therefore EVVVVVILLLLLLL.

    Capitalism with limits is fine. You keep cutting the fucking brake lines though, and then blaming us when we all go over the cliff edge,
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  26. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    Ain't the one spewing it.

    I'm the guy trying to get you to take the anti-emetics, but you keep chugging hooch and blaming me when you puke your own asshole up.
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  27. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    THIS.

    The thing is, I even went out of my way to concede that anything I wanted for such a community would take a lot of blood, sweat, tears, and effort. That it would be baby steps, that it would require a solid foundation, higher levels of education, and a way to get people to understand they wouldn't have to sell their lives just to stay alive, and the reaction was still priceless. It's like they think capitalism just happened overnight and everyone was happy as a pig in shit. The colonialism, the slavery, the murders, the insurrections, all of it ancient history even though the United States does these things now to maintain its economic supremacy. It reminds me of that scene in DS9 between Weyoun and Damar:




    "You say I live in a communist fantasy world, but doesn't your economic system require people to believe in the lie that they can be just as wealthy as everyone else?"
    "That's different."
    "How is it your capitalist fantasy world different?"
    "Because in my fantasy world it's all true."
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  28. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    So Steve Jobs didn't come from nothing, he was born rich? John Lennon wasn't from a poor family, he was born rich? etc, etc, How are these fantasies?
  29. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    The fantasy is that everyone could be Steve Jobs, or even just middle class, if they would only work harder or be smarter. America is full of folks busting their goddamn asses and earning just enough to scrape by.

    Returning to my lab tech. She has a Ph.D same as I do. She took the tech job because at the time it offered more job security than 3-year postdoc contracts, but the pay hasn't kept up with what she does. It would actually be BETTER for her to go onto benefits, but she has her pride and wants to keep her skills active.

    Capitalist fantasy 101: Hard Work Pays Off.

    Fucking bullshit.

    I was LUCKY to get out of that 3-year contract shit. I didn't work harder or be smarter than her. I got given a chance. Now I earn twice her salary, but she underpins my work.
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2019
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  30. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

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    That and Steve Jobs cheated Woz out of most of his money, and it was Woz who designed and built the systems. Plus, Woz did it for the joy of doing it, not for financial gain.
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