Get rid of El Chup or I'm gone

24 hours.

Yes, I know, don't let the door hit me in the ass.

But having mods intentionally troll other users drives off posters. The mods shouldn't be in a position to determine membership. This is why every other fucking board on the internet doesn't let mods troll their users.

http://www.wordforge.net/showthread.php?t=71073

If there is no integrity left here, than I have no point in posting here. I find it offensive.

As I don't expect anything to be done, even when it's beyond clear that El Chup as a mod is part of the problem and not part of the solution, I'd like to thank all my friends here for years of excellent debate and good humor.

You can reach me at fartheststar@gmail.com if you want to correspond.

Wow, I'm quite impressed with how I am managing to inadvertantly turn myself into a Cass style hate figure. People really must be bored these days to be going after me after 6 years. There was a time when I couldn't even get noticed!

Anyhow, as for the post you linked to, it's the Red Room dude. Mods, admins and Lanz are all regular posters as well and there is no higher set of rules for us in the Red Room than you.

You are asking me to be removed because I boxed a few threads and posted like everybody else does in the Red Room. Yeah, great reason to "de-mod" me.

Enjoy your drama. See you when you return.

This is crazy Demi. It's the Red Room. Plus it's an accurate portrayal IMHO of aqua-whatever his name is.

The second part is irrelevant.

You want new members? How about the mods not attacking the few new ones we get.

I'm sure the rank and file won't see it that way, which is why I expect not to be here 24 hours from now.

But saying 'it's just this asshole' is irrelevant. There's an implied threat with someone in power with the ability to get you banned coming after you.

And yes, I went after Tamar long and hard about that. But I'm about done with the foolishness - there's enough idiots in real life that I don't have to spend time with it online.

Lot's of great posters here, which kept me around, and I'll miss quite a few folks.

Yes, being an incompetent placed in a position of power does tend to get you noticed.

Which is wrong.

Everyone else doesn't have the power to get someone banned.

Oh, and if you think those are the only two things you've done to piss people off you are pretty obtuse.

Believe it or not I do have other options than posting here - even doing things in real life!

I say it is quite a stretch to say El Chup is after the guy. Maybe I'm missing something in that particular post of smilies.

So what you're saying is that because I have the power to ban people I plan on using it against those I parody in the Red Room?

Um, yeah, ok Demi. I think you've fallen off the map on this one. I've no plans to ban anyone and I have only ever issued one warning in my time here.

So come on, let me have a list of the oh so terrible things that I have done that are so awfully serious that you feel the need to up sticks and leave.

I'm actually with El Chup if he managed to drive off Hong.

I'm not after him at all. He's having a mess around with us with his bizarre posting style, so I'm just having a bit of a joke with him in response. It is the Red Room after all. If Demi wants to wet his pants and pull a hissy fit then he could have at least picked something with there is a least some suggestion that I may have done something outside the rules.

I would like to think that a parody post is not enough to drive off someone who understands what WF is about.

El Chup, you have had more complaints against you than the rest of the mods since Lanz took over put together.

Instead of looking at that as feedback, you feel that they aren't justified and refuse to change your posting style. You think what you are doing is just peachy.

OK, it's up to Lanz if he wants to keep you on.

I'm pretty much done with the BS. Attacking folks in a room you moderate because you don't think their intelligence is up to spec is just bullying.

When you did it before joining the staff I didn't care.

But I think its bad for the board for the mods to bully and make fun of the members.

I don't care if it is a guy who 'deserves' it.

But if Lanz doesn't care, that's up to him. I've done stuff here to prove a point before, I'll do it again if necessary.

I got into a few fights back in my school days standing up to people who were trying to bully other people too.

Balls in Lanz court.

It goes back to a point I've made all along - mods aren't just another poster, especially in their rooms.

Ultimatums tend to rob one of choice. I'd rather you didn't stake your participation upon any member being on staff.

Do what you do, regardless of outcome I hope you decide to stick around.






btw - I'm starting to suspect you, Chu and Zombie are in cahoots!

LOL. That would be my point.

LOL, well the last part isn't true.

I've addressed my concerns with the policy that staff trolling members over the last few years, including under Lanz's regime when El Chup was closing threads because of their political content.

It will probably make Lanz dig in his heels, I understand that.

But I think it's a point that I have to make at this juncture. One of those 'principle' things.

Um....sorry, but Aquahaonga is a well calculated troll who, ultimately, is quite good at what he does. I don't think El Chup was even near driving him off.

Alas, as much as a desire to be in with the cool kids I have not yet made it

Of course, I'll have to return to staff to replace him if he's removed.

LOL, NOW who's threatening people.

I have never closed a thread because of political opinion.

The problem here is that you lot take the reasons I give for doing things, automatically bin them as rubbish and than replace them with invented reasons of your own. Cases in point:-

1) The drama over apostle's thread. I was told I didn't like his political opinion as if I am left wing....when in fact I am not left wing.

2) Dayton's boxset. I am told that the threads were boxed because I didn't like the fact that he was slating the new Trek movie.....when in fact I reviewed it negatively myself.

3) This complaint. I am told that I am trying to drive a member because....um, welll nobody came up with a reason why I am.


Those false reasons then get rubbed into the collective memory, which generates increased drama whenever you the perceive there to be another wrong. I suspect that the reason many of you can't handle the truth of why I have done things is because so many of you do engage in attempts to drive off membersm and so forth, as I have witnessed in PMs sent to me, that you simple think that anyone who does anything here must have an agenda. That is truly sad.

If any of you had the guts to accept the reasons I give for the decisions I have made you will actually see that all I have ever done is attempted to do what I thought was in the interests of upholding the rules and keeping the place clean and tidy.

There are no special restrictions on how staff choose to post here at Wordforge. That has been true under every owner the board has had.

If, however, a moderator abuses their "special" powers (closing threads, editing posts, warnings, etc) that is a different case. The example you've chosen, Demi, is nothing more than typical Red Room behaviour. An odd thing to get worked up over.

Wordforge is kinda like a gang in that regard. New people get beat on, and if they stick it out they become regulars. If they have thin skin, they go all weepy and run away or else avoid the Red and Gray rooms. This is how most of you have said you want things to be.

Should it be that way? Probably not . . . maybe new posters should not be able to access Red and Gray until they've "put in their time" in the other, more protected fora. Gotten to know how things work here. Or maybe access to Red and Gray should require approval from someone on staff.

As for the rest, well, let's see.

Unless ya'll have changed things, Gray Room already requires a conscious and intentional effort to join. Noone is in there accidently.

Yeah, Bear, but it doesn't require anything more than clicking a checkbox in your User CP to join the Gray Room. There's no approval process or gifts of frankincense and myrrh or like that.

I think in reality most new members will click to join all forum so that they can fully explore the place.

I agree with Demi. Mods shouldn't be "going after" newbies.

Once said newbie has been around for awhile - 6 months or so depending on how often both newbie and respective mod posts - then the mod in question can post whatever they want.

But, I've said it before, when a mod's behavior creates an adverse environment for a new poster, it isn't likely the board will get, or keep, many new posters.

that said, I like Chup.

Then why fuck around?
Go.

Indeed. And something I've argued against with every owner the board has had.

Just another in a long line of examples.

And of course the mod in question has told people not to spam his forums because he viewed their political postings as spam, has not known the rules in his own forum that he's trying to enforce, and continues to make poor and uninformed decisions. Just my opinion obviously, but I think you can make a strong case for it.

For the members, absolutely. For the mods? I've always argued against that - the mods shouldn't be the one joining in the gang initiations, and sure as hell shouldn't be the one STARTING the beatings.

Well, there's one thing we agree on.

I'm not sure that's the right way to go. I think it's a different order of severity to have the posters fucking with you and having the staff fucking with you. One has sanction, the other doesn't.

If the guy is such a problem that he's causing issues in the forum, but it isn't something that the mod in question can get involved in because the rules don't allow it, then it's time to alter the rules of the forum.

But I have yet to see any of El Chup's judgments that caused blowback to be one that was necessary to the integrity of the Red Room.

Fair enough.

At the very least Liet will be happy.

Demi, I like you really well, but I think you have chosen your battle poorly here.

One of the things I like best about WF is that the mods can also post just like regular posters, for the most part. As I have said openly, on multiple occasions, I do not think Chup understands what a mod's role is, nor how far the authority extends, and if he cannot be made to see that and change, I would be in agreement that he has no place on staff.

But him trolling people in the Red Room? I just can't see a problem with it. Posters are allowed to troll other posters in the Red Room, and when he or anyone else isn't wearing their "mod hat," they're just posters like anyone else. That very principle is what allows the rest of us to treat them "just like anyone else" except when they are carrying out their functions as mods, too.

​

Yeah, Demi. Talk to this guy. He knows a thing or two about running away.



Anyway.....

It's the Red Room. The whole point is unrestricted speech/flaming/shit talking. I don't think restricting that right for staff members is a good idea. I'm all for burning staff members in a fire when they threaten to ban someone because they start to many threads on a topic they don't like.

But just trolling the tool of the week?