Indeed. And they say "I brought it into the red room - and it's true I disclosed my condition here annd am not ashamed of it. but going into detail about my wife and kids is, at least, a demonstration of a complete absence of class and humanity, even if it doesn't specifically break a rule.
Who went into detail? The only thing I've ever said about your wife and kids was that it must be hard on them. But hey, keep on posting articles from DailyKos to backup whatever the hell you're trying to backup. I find it all very amusing. I think you fell for the troll. Oops.
I hope you enjoyed it. I used to have some respect for you but this garbage illustrated your true colors quite clearly and will certainly impact how I see your future postings. Fucking hilarious that is. Why don't you take the douchebag act to TK, they need the traffic and you'll get the kind of support your looking for there, I'm sure.
Yeah, had a lot of respect for Azure up to this point. Not so much now. If it was a troll, it was a stupid troll.
Riled up? I think she's a hell of a lot more patient with this kind of bullshit than most people would be.
I gotta be honest, I definitely have opinions on the matter that would obviously not be popular around here, but I think enough of Nova that I would never dream of trolling Nova over it.
The only thing I don't understand is, knowing the job situation in your area, and knowing that transgender people are rarely hired, why, Nova, you would choose to go so open with this transition at the one time you HAD to get a job. Like, seriously, ya could have waited 6 more months, got hired somewhere, and then transitioned. Then if they fired you, you'd have plenty of ammo to sue them. I seriously don't understand why you made your job search literally impossible. Not trolling btw, and your employment situation has been brought up outside of the Blue Room, so I don't think I'm out of bounds here.
He couldn't get work for years as a man, either. I wonder how well she could hold down a job with suicidal depression and deep self-hatred filling her mind?
It's not like the current situation is any better. She's been suicidally depressed and self-hating for a good while after the transition too. Killing any and all prospects is a pretty stupid idea, IMO, considering she was able to get multiple interviews and any one of them could have resulted in a job. Anyway, this is getting really Blue Room. I just wanted Nova's explanation as to why she didn't at least show up as a man to the interviews to land the job. I sure as hell would have.
I really don't give a shit what you think of me. Just find it strange that y'all think that what Nova is doing is actually the solution to his problems. Sure, he obviously has a problem, but anyone in that boat should see doctors and specialists. I'm pretty sure he would be much happier if he could get those fucked up feelings out of his head and go back to being normal, but someone who is suicidally depressed has a tendency of digging themselves into a deep hole, and hell will freeze over before they will get out again. And you know what the biggest fucking problem is with that? The almost always have family and friends that help them get away with while they go to hell in a hand basket. That cousin I was talking about earlier. He also struggled with suicidal thoughts and depression issues. Pretty crazy stuff too. And his parents always figured he was still their angel. Other family friends offered to put up the money to get him into a recovery centre, but no fucking way. There was nothing wrong with their angel. No matter what he did, no matter who he threatened to kill, there was never anything wrong with it. So how will his life go? One of these days I'll get a phone call saying he blew his brains out. Sad, really....because what his parents and close friends say means something to him, and if they would open their fucking eyes and stop letting him get away with the moronic excuses he has, and help get him into a recovery centre where professionals can deal with his problem, there would be hope. Is Nova in the same situation? Has he seen doctors? Specialists? I honestly have no idea. But anyone that deals with severe mental issues like suicidal thoughts and depression needs professional help. Deciding to be the opposite sex is NOT the solution to that problem. It only compounds it. Unless you're naive enough to think that him having to transition into a life like that will just turn everything into roses. And it seems like some of your are stupid enough to believe that shit. All trolling aside, if I were having serious mental problems and suicidal thoughts, I would pray that my family had the balls to do what is right, instead of letting me win them over with every excuse that I come up with. And given the severity of such situations, deciding that I'm supposed to be a girl wouldn't be that far of a stretch for someone with those kinds of problems.
Azure, anyone even considering undergoing gender reassignment has to first go through an extensive course of counseling. The medical course also takes years, and therapy is ongoing to make absolutely certain that this is what the individual wants. You can probably find the AMA guidelines somewhere if you're genuinely interested in the information.
You think the hormones are free? I've only read bits of the BR thread, but the information you're looking for is probably there. If, again, you're actually looking for information.
One is not obliged to ignore a troll when one recognizes a troll. the conversation is often not just between the troll and the target. "falling for" implies that the target was lulled into thinking the troll was sincere. You should not assume that.
the what now? No. Not REMOTELY the case. I have had moments of isolated, event driven, misery created directly by (Blue Room material) but that's not at all the sort of "self-hating" depression as before. it's like being depressed right after you got a raise and being depressed right after you got fired - they are not examples of the same thing. Because - for starters - your thesis that if i transitioned on the job and got fired I'd have a basis for legal action is wildly incorrect. In the vast majority of legal jurisdictions (including this one) you can not only fire a person for transitioning but you can tell them to their face that's what you are doing and you are safe from legal action. Some businesses CLAIM to have an inclusive policy - but the inclusive policy would, if actually followed, include hiring you in the first place, not just protecting you from being fired. It's difficult to answer this question and stay Red-Room, there are things I do not want to serve up permission to troll. But the reasons for my ongoing unemployment range far afield from my transition, and while it is impossible to say for sure that there hasn't been ANY instance where I would have been hired "as a guy", the circumstances and the track record (over the last five years) and relevant information make it safe to say that the odds of that being true are sufficiently small that there was no logic in holding out for them - it would have been akin to assuming my budget problems will be better after a trip to the casino. Basically, if what you were saying were actually true - get hired as a guy -> proceed to transition -> get fired unjustly -> sue the fuck out of them and win - was ACTUALLY correct, then yes it would have been the obvious thing to do. But it's not true. so what you would actually have is: get hired as a guy -> proceed to transition -> get fired unjustly _> be shit-out-of-luck -> be repeatedly advised that i was stupid to risk my job by transitioning and my problems were thus my own fault _> have every other potential employer see me as untrustworthy because i failed to disclose my plans before being hired. The much better argument is the one Ancalagon makes - "you should have got the fuck out of Mississippi" and that reasoning, however flawed, has already been discussed in the Blue Room.
Oh - and to clarify - i haven't gotten "multiple interviews" in the sense you mean. I've been interviewed TWICE, both times by Wal-Mart. and I've put in hundreds of applications, the majority of which do not reflect any unusual gender status on the page - I was "non-interviewed" before the HR person ever knew I was trans.
Ok, that clears that up. From your blog you'd sounded far more depressed and the job prospects probably sounded more optimistic than they really were. Can't fault you for trying to think positively. Thanks for the reply!
Which kind of illustrates a point, unintentionally: if there's anything I've learned in the last 3 years is how the vast majority of firmly help opinion, when expressed, is revealed to have almost no relationship with the actual truth. to take the most recent exchange - I know TKO has the best of intentions towards me and has no bigotry towards folks with my condition, but innocently she simply assumed that the law forbids discrimination against trans people and that there is an ability to seek legal redress when it happens. There is NOT. Not in any place in the Southeast and not in most places in the U.S. in fact, Nashville passed an ordinance which included it and it pissed off the rest of the state so bad the Legislature outlawed the passing of such ordinances. Just recently a third county in Maryland specifically addressed it and, of course, there was a months long political firestorm about "male perverts in the ladies room" (instead of about jobs and housing naturally) and after it passed petitions immediately started floating around seeking a referendum on it. If a friend can innocently make a false assumption like that, then just imagine what the hostile person thinks in willful error. It's not as if the information isn't out there. 20 years ago one might be forgiven for ignorance o nthe subject, but now days if you are ill informed it's because you make no effort not to be. which is fine. what's not fine (and this is for folks like Azure, not TKO) is to presume to go ahead and express your ill-informed OPINIONS as if it's reliable factual reality. if you want to be ignorant, that's your right, but you ought to not think that you can sell your ignorance as fact.
I don't want to sound inconsistent - there WERE dark days, and still are on occasion. I just trust that you remember from the blog what events provoked those moments. when you are...shit, I just can't address it here. PM me if you want and I'll be more clear.
That's one hell of a leap you're making...unless there's something you're not sharing with the rest of the class I've felt depressed and angry and jealous of some of my friends for having relationships when I've never had even one, but I've never thought that I need to go gay.
Huh. So this IS a troll thread after all. Damn, I'm shocked. God, this is one of the most pathetic trolls on WF in a long fucking time. I'd say this is Meka-level stupidity, except that debacle was started with semi-decent intentions.
Regarding discrimination laws, it's a lot easier to make a case if you're fired than if you're simply not hired ... the latter would be darn near impossible to prove because there are so many factors, both tangible and intangible, that go into a hiring decision, while with firing there's the simple question of "were you doing the job well or weren't you." But in the absence of those laws, it's pretty much moot anyway...
