I don't care which side of the debate you are on in regards to whether Nova is really a girl or really a guy, or whether Nova's legit in wanting to be a woman, or mentally ill. But if you are seriously arguing that Nova's change of life isn't incredibly selfish with respect to his wife and his children, then you need your head examined. And yes, I know I am probably talking to people I consider friends. C'est la vie.
So her alternative is to pretend to be something she's not, to live with the increasing internal anxiety and pressure, in order to placate others and their sensibilities? Where's the fairness in that? What this sounds like is a situation that is too damned complicated for armchair quarterbackers to evaluate and judge from the sidelines.
I'm not trying to win you toward anything. You've already made up your mind. Nothing I say will change it, though I did figure I would at least point out that it's not so simple as how you've stated it.
Good. Nnnyyyyyeahhhhh... technically true, but not about the thing you think I have. You've made up your mind too, Mr. Open Minded. You don't know that. I've changed my mind on lots of things that I thought I'd never change. And I confident in my POV? Sure, but nothing is absolute. Actually, it really is. You're just trying to make more of an argument of the situation than I am.
As I have foreseen it! (sorry, when I hear the word "Good", it's always in the Emperor's voice). Yeah, I've made up my mind and have come to my conclusions. Still, that doesn't mean I'll stay that way if better data is presented. Remember, I used to be a devout Christian who was damned certain that nothing could uproot me from my faith. Whoops. To be fair, this is the Red Room. I'm used to obstinate from all angles. Eh, no. Rarely is anything always so black and white. Yes, the wife and kids are going to feel hurt. That doesn't mean this was something Nova could have avoided. It's like when a married couple gets divorced. It can seem like a selfish thing, but it is far better to stop the continued pain and sort it all out as a family. There WILL be pain, and there WILL be broken hearts, but they can be mended if the primary issue is brought out in the open and dealt with. That takes time and patience.
It amazes me the amount of douchebaggery that's going on in this thread. It's Nova's life and decision. It makes no difference if she is transgendered, gay, or just decided to have a divorce and live her own life. It doesn't make one goddamn bit of difference what YOU or I think. She can live her life the way she she chooses.
It's only selfish if you have a choice. The feelings won't stop so what then? Given that Nova does everything short of pretending to be a guy to placate and support them just what else is she to do?
Wife? Yeah. perhaps. but there's a history there - which I shall reserve for the Blue Room - of which you are unaware. If one assumes i am nothing but selfish as relates to her, one is judging without crucial information. Hopefully we've all learned by now how that leads to error. As relates to the kids - one must first start with the assumption that what i am is, by definition, wrong in order to argue that the motives are selfish at the expense of the boys. In reality, what they have learned from this is a crucial life lesson in all sort of very good things, among them platitudes which have been conventional wisdom for as long as men have been thinking: Treat others as you wish to be treated It's what is on the inside that counts Be yourself, even if no one else understands Better to be hated for who you are than loved for who you are not Be compassionate towards those who are not like yourself Everyone has flaws, love people in spite of them. And so VERY many more.They know these things now not as platitudes or corny sayings people like to post on Facebook, but from real life experience. They know now that people like me are not "freaks" or "perverts" or "weird" - but ordinary everyday people who love and wish to be loved. And they know the difference in standing up for what you know to be true in the face of ignorant opposition, and bowing the knee to the expectations of the culture, no matter how irrational those expectations. They know something about the people who walk among us who have to take shit from the so-called "normal" people because the normals are to heartless and bigoted to take the time to show compassion for those they don't understand. it's just a little harder, hopefully, to look down on the "faggot" who crosses their path. Good parenting? Mother-fucking STRAIGHT that's good parenting. I'm not a perfect parent in a thousand little ways (and if you have kids, so are you) but this ain't one of them.
Of course it is. It's difficult for both of them. But: Even though we don't always control what happens to us in live, we do get to choose how we respond and how it affects us. I know I'm treading a thin line with Blue Room information here, but it's pretty obvious that Nova's wife has made some choices about how she's going to be affected. If she's unhappy, she bears some responsibility for keeping herself that way.
Indeed. the basic alternatives are these: a. Become an increasingly cold, bitter, useless asshole withdrawn into my own misery and drinking my 500 pound life away on the sofa b. eat a bullet (or something similar) c. Transition I'm pretty sure both the first two would have been more selfish towards spouse and children, and a worse example of parenting skills. Those who say "suck it up and overcome it" are simply being condescending on a subject they don't know enough about to speak to.
it's fascinating how for some people THIS particular thing is a thing unlike all other things. People can experience all manner of fuck ups in their life and that's just living but THIS? This is just fucking sick. the power of the sacred penis or something I guess.
Well I have no idea what his wife said, but I wouldn't blame her if she took the kids and got the hell out. You know, I could understand if one of the parents got a new job across the country somewhere, and the whole family had to move. Lots have done so and have probably made do just fine. But in my opinion its pretty selfish when daddy comes home and says he wants to be mommy instead. I find it hard to believe that the solution to any problem Nova has is being the opposite sex. If you're a single guy, fine. But he has a wife and kids to think about, and I'm pretty damn sure it'll be hard on them. Especially since its pretty doubtful that he'll ever be able to afford the surgery. So he'll live the rest of his life telling everyone he's a girl.
Yeah, but no. Have you talked to your doctor? Seen a specialist? Actually honestly tried to lose weight to become healthier and better looking? Overweight and obese people get all kinds of crazy stupid thoughts in their head because they hate what they look and feel like. I'm dealing with a situation like that with one of my cousins. He's a fatass that doesn't want to do anything else beside sit around on the computer and eat pizza all day. Result? He's tried to commit suicide twice and has taken a knife against his father. He has every excuse in the damn book. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he starting saying he is a girl trapped in a guy's body. That would be tame compared to the other crap he has pulled.
Oh I doubt it. Is there even any scientific research done that proves its even possible for a guy to be trapped in a girl's body?
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.23...id=2134&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=47698784539077 http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.23...id=2134&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=47698784539077 and dozens more. Just search JSTOR for psych journals and you'll find tons.
QFT. Which is what, o wise judgmental one? From what I understand, Nova's been trying to do the right thing for the better part of four decades. Frankly, I'm surprised at this level of douchebaggery out of Azure, who usually just trolls for lulz and the dumb shit people say in the RR. I dunno where he was when Nova made this announcement, but the fact that even Flashlight and Dicky (two posters who had the most amount of distain for her when she was Shepard) didn't make a campaign of trolling her, should be pretty telling that you're a fucking classless moron.
He was around. In fact he recycled some of the same material for this thread. http://www.wordforge.net/showthread.php?p=1816567#post1816567 I also found this.
