Star Trek Discovery. [SPOILERS WITHIN]

I think the "he's a Breen" theory is real solid as fan theories go, but I see no sign he aspires to rule. In the alternate future they saw, I'd sooner guess that he's wanted by the Breen and they are watching his progress ready to grab the prize when (if) he finds it.

"Mirrors"

I nearly fell asleep halfway through the episode. It's one thing to have emotional beats every so often, that's fine, that's great! I love exposition when done properly, but nearly this entire episode was essentially just an infodump, with some really frustrating flickering lighting in-between.

Good on the fans for getting it right. I don't know if we had ever before seen a Breen without a helmet, or really know anything about them other than in DS9 they'd sided with the Dominion, they had an energy weapon that was devastating, they wore helmets and spoke funny, and there was a saying, "Never turn your back on a Breen."

I think the sexuality/trans allegory is a little hamfisted, but what Trek allegories aren't?

To the extent this episode was supposed to make us sympathetic with Mol and L'ak, I think it was a failure. Maybe this comes from not being able to appreciate the import of the bounty in part. It seems like, it being a big universe and all, there's plenty of places the two of them could go where there is no chance that the Breen would ever find them. Especially with the assistance of Discovery that can literally jump anywhere. If all they want is to live in peace with their love, hopping to the remote reaches of the galaxy ought to do it. And the notion that this big bad bounty could be wiped clean if they present the Progenitor tech to the Breen also doesn't make sense -- it would be just as easy for the Breen to say, "Thanks, suckers!" and kill them. Finally, if L'ak is an outcast who generally hates the Breen and was well-aware of their shortcomings even before the bounty was put on his head, he ought to have a pretty good idea why it would be a terrible idea to hand them unlimited power.

Haven't seen "Mirrors" yet. Maybe tonight.

"Jinaal":

I enjoyed getting to revisit Trill culture and see another Zhian'tara.

Jinaal's test was very Classic Trek.

The episode did remind me that while Gray is the kind of person who would probably make a great friend in real life, he is not a very interesting TV character.

"Face the Strange":

I'm not generally a big fan of the timey-wimey weirdness, but I liked this better than the VOY episode with a similar premise.

Burnham meeting herself was a good moment. Usually if you want to show the contrast between different parts of a character's arc, you have to tell rather than show, and this device allowed them to show it. Plus there's a good inspirational message there about resilience, persistence, and hope.

I liked watching the clash between Rayner and Tilly. As somebody who isn't that comfortable with emotional connection, but is frequently around people who are the opposite, I can really identify with Rayner's difficulty adapting to a ship run by Burnham's command style. I also think he'll ultimately make a really good foil for her, and he'll end up as a Jellico-type character who makes people go "OK, now I can see that he really isn't a bad leader, just different."

So can we now say that DSC and SNW is a full on reboot? That was not the TOS version of the Enterprise. This episode was bad and confusing and I didn't like Moll and Lak's backstory and I didn't like the new look of the Breen. I'm guessing the Enterprise gets a refit and this season will end with a showdown between the Breen with the Enterprise, Discovery and the Anteres in the fight. Maybe Voyager J will show up too.

That was the ISS Enterprise, and these aren't reboots. The only thing that has really been changed are the visuals.

ISS Enterprise, years after Spock's progressive rebellion and the internal collapse of the TE to what we saw in DS9.

arguably, it coulda/shoulda been the "A".

But as RM says, only thing truly rebooted is the visuals. Everything else is just "stuff we didn't know" being added to canon.

We've seen the ISS Enterprise and the ISS Defiant and the nacelle struts shouldn't be swooped back, the medical bay should look different. The neck should be longer as well, it shouldn't look like Pike's Enterprise.

This confused the shit out of me. So they mutinied after Spock took over and made reforms and Suru was on board? Who the hell is Dr. Cho? How long was this after Spock took over? How did the vile of blue liquid get on the ISS Enterprise when the progeneters were around billions of years ago?

Like I said, visual changes, that's all.
If you go by visual changes, then every Star Trek series is an alternate universe, and that just wouldn't make sense.

My theory? When the crew ultimately abandons Discovery to set up "Calypso" they move into the ISS Enterprise refit and rechristened as the USS Enterprise K.

Nope, Rayner gets the Enterprise with Rhyse as his number one. Remember they both like Constitution class ships.

i don't remember, was it a mutiny or had they commandeered the ship to rescue all those refugees?
Saru survived season 1, he could be anywhere in 30 years. Especially a rescue vessel.
Who Dr Cho is doesn't matter. MU so her prime counterpart would need to be dead for her to exist here (without swapping realities, of course) was my concern. She's the one who places the blue goo "years later". It's MacGuffin and teh progenitors aren't really relevant other than as an story anchor /shrug
I'm gonna go with about 30-40 years after Spock Suraked the TE. Does DS9's MU make any mention of how long before the K-C alliance conquered them? I'd figure there'd be a few violent secessions before and leading to that. It's already there and Dr Cho went back to it to hide the clue of the week.

Yes. I think we last saw Mirror Saru starting off as a pet/future meal of Terran Empress Georgiou and were told at some point he became a freedom fighter. So apparently this is part of the fight for freedom he engaged in.

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Saru_(mirror)

Apparently a Mirror Universe denizen who somehow made it to the Prime Universe around the time of "The Chase" and was one of the six people who figured out where the Progenitors' tech is and helped set up the clue hunt.

Why does that matter? If it was within 5 minutes or 2 decades after, who cares?

The implication is that each of the six scientists who found the Progenitors' tech set up their individual part of the clue hunt to allow a worthy person or person to find it. Dr. Cho was one such person, and in the blue vial, she apparently decided to hide her clue back in this pocket of interdimensional space from whence she came.

P.S. we don't necessarily know if the Progenitors have completely died out. Maybe at the end of the clue hunt, we will find out some are still alive, or some have time traveled, etc.

The ISS Enterprise has been the only noteworthy part of this whole season.
Mirror Constitution Warship from STO. One of my favorite murder boats.

Thanks for clearing that up, but good lord this is some convoluted shit going on.

You’re just not happy with anything, are you?

Well, guess what asshole. The more you complain, the less Star Trek and Star Wars or anything else you’re going to get.

The more you complain, hte less likely studios will invest in science fiction.

And all because of assholes like you, the genre will die.

No, not just you. You’ve got Canadian Farmer (@We Are Borg ) to back you up.

They aren't going to stop making shows because someone complains online. They'll stop making them if nobody fucking watches them, and nobody should entertain a moment's remorse for refusing to watch something made by people who hold you in contempt.

Do you even pay attention to anything that I post in this thread? I liked last week’s episode and the one before that. Idiot. Why aren’t you calling your boyfriend an asshole for not liking the show? Guess what, we’re allowed to not like things.

It’s not about liking or disliking a show.

And yes, they absolutely will stop making science fiction because that’s the world in which we currently live.

But sure. Continue to bitch. Whatever. I’ll be dead soon and I won’t have to worry about it.

Exactly, Lower Decks and Discovery were canceled because not enough people were watching them. Lower Decks is really good and I’m sad to see it go, but they don’t call it show biz for no reason.

You literally just called me an asshole because I didn’t like this episode. You and @Diacanu beeate people if they like the things you like, you’re the problem with fandom.

Don't drag me into your bullshit.

You’re such a child.

I did not berate you for disliking the episode. But, sure, child that you are, fixate on that.

Eh, who cares?
The E-D had carpet remnants stuffed under the chairs that suddenly weren't there in Picard season 3.
How pedantic do we want to get about this?

I just don’t understand why they are so afraid to show us the original Enterprise, DS9 and Enterprise had no issues with showing us a ship design from the 60s. Who’s dual are you, by the way?

Seeing the 60's ship edifies us oldster fanboys, but if we ever invent warp, and build an Enterprise, it's not going to look like the 60's ship. It's just not.
Hell, it'll probably be more like the 32nd century Discovery.

LOL, I'm Crosis's dual.
I had lost access to my old account. ShootER gave it back, but I'm lazy.

And at this point, showing the "old" design would clash with another ongoing series, so why even go there?

Because it doesn’t matter what he bitches about, as long as he bitches about something.