What has improved since 2008?

Not rhetorical at all. You want to try to answer one without posting cute little monkeys, Mr. anti-obfuscation?

...and if asking how the RE crash of 07 is Obama's fault makes me some kind of Obama apologist, then I'll have some of what you're smoking.

Don't you know? Obama is to blame for everything. There are no other factors at work.

He may even have killed Jebus.

We're actually experiencing the RE crash of 1990, with a slight lag, so it's Reagan/Bush 1's fault. [And we simply ignore the 2011 housing drop completely.]

You mean just like your ilk blamed Bush for everything that went wrong in the world?????

Funny how that works!

Things have been pretty fucking fantastic in Canada since 2008, thanks for asking eh!

Don't be so hard on yourself. Blinkered, perhaps, but not hopeless.

To you, obviously, not. It's all just calculus to you. You're completely oblivious to the human element that says "Cut the other guy's program. I NEEEEEED mine!!!!"

So, okay, I'll play your game. Farm subsidies. Initially meant to provide subsistence to family farms in times of flood, drought, crop failure. Evolved into a huge government giveaway to corporate farms of thousands of acres, essentially paying them to NOT grow certain crops, or sometimes not grow anything at all.

How is that materially different from the woman on welfare churning out a baby a year to increase her benefits?

Different in some ways, not so different in others.

Now go ahead and make the case for how we NEEEEED farm subsidies or the global economy will collapse.

Then tell me how that differs from the bank bailouts.

So cut out the farm subsidies and let the woman get an abortion and pay for it with her own money.

See, your problem is that you're just not paying attention. I'm against all three equally.

According to the stereotype, she doesn't want an abortion. She wants more babies so she can get more benefits.

Obama is a significant factor in the where our debt and deficit is right now. You can blame whomever you'd like for the real estate market. But, Obama did not have to spend us trillions of dollars into debt for it. The solution to our nations economic problems is not throwing us deeper and deeper into debt. That is flat out the most fucking stupid thing Obama and two Congresses have allowed to happen.

... my paycheck.

My kids can stay on my health insurance until the age of 26

You seem to be suggesting that the current administration would have created a deficit just for the hell of it even if there had been no real estate crash and no deficit created by the previous administration.

Which'll come in handy because they'll either be unemployed or working part time at the Chicken Shack.


Energy Independence has improved to...


President’s policies push gas prices even higher than before release of reserves

Never mind.

In fairness to KIRK, we've pretty much had nonstop deficit spending for the last few decades. Of course, if the debt increases slower than GDP, it's not too much of an issue.

Yeah, and how many personnel have we deployed to Libya vs. our commitments to Afghanistan and Iraq? And how much more/less is it compared to other areas of the world where we have military personnel? Hell, there's a bigger US military presence in Germany compared to Libya.

I have no reason for believing we'll be completely out of Iraq and Afghanistan for at least a generation, but that doesn't mean a reduction in total personnel deployed is a bad thing. But Libya is a drop in the water compared to Bush's pet wars.

And going back to Muad Dib's post about things getting worse since Bush left office, he seems to be purposefully ignoring the fact that our current financial crisis started while Bush was still in office.

There's quite a presence in Germany; while Bush was President, the same was true of Afghanistan rather than Libya.

So far. But soon Yemen and Syria will be on the list.

Oy. Y'all need to grok the fact that no matter who was president, this is mostly the Fed's fault for creating the bubbles in the first place.

Re: Afghanistan vs. Libya, the first was an invasion intended to target Al Qaeda whereas the second is a civil war we are taking sides in. And the future will only tell whether we will get involved in more combat.

And I was not commenting on who's fault it was, but rather establishing the time frame. The implied premise of this whole thread is that things went downhill once Obama took office, ignoring the fact that he did not in fact take office in 2008 when things were already going downhill.

Point of order: You may have asked how the real estate market crashing before Obama was President was His fault. But you also asked a bunch of stuff about the "double dip." That was what I answered.

That said, if you really want me to tackle your first question: When a man and a woman love each other very much...whoops, wrong answer.

George W. Bush was President from 2001-2009. For his entire first term and much of his second term, the economy chugged along fairly well. In spite of a major terrorist attack on the heart of our financial center and a recession he inherited from his predecessor, things moved along pretty well until around 2007. Would you care to guess who (along with a bunch of other Democrats) became a Senator in 2007?

I'll give you a hint:

Ah. Of course. Why didn't I see it sooner?

went back to school and got to quit being a slave in a cubicle. that was exciting. oh, and i saved over 50% by switching to geico. true story.

To summarize the thread so far:

KIRK1ADM asked what has improved since 2008, presumably confident in nobody being able to name anything.

Several people gave ways in which their lives and economic situations actually are significantly better, which were promptly dismissed as unimportant. The people doing the dismissal then proceeded to insist that a variety of trailing indicators are the only ones that count, since those are the ones that fit the desired conclusion.

(Here's an explanation of leading vs. trailing indicators, for anyone who needs a refresher in Econ 101.)

If she doesn't get the benefits, she doesn't need the babies. The kids are the tickets to ride the Gravy Train.

They're the tickets to tax deductionville for everyone anyway.

And?

I get tax deductions on mine, but then, I support my own children.

And..they're tickets to tax deductionville for everyone anyway. There is no fucking "and" you nimrod.

You don't work at a job?

What's improved since '08?

1. My Gold has about doubled.
2. My Silver has about tripled.
3. I've added two weapons to the inventory.
4. My ammo count is waaaay up!

no. i have an interview on monday though - wish me luck! :0)

Good luck.