Which Show Sucked More: ST:VOY or ST:Enterprise?

I was really unimpressed with a captain that got beat up every other episode.

 

That old Ron Moore interview pretty much sums up everything wrong with Voyager. I'm not gonna dig it up, but I'm sure you've all seen it before...

Enterprise was just a mess from day one... how can you make a good prequel to TOS when the guys running the show have admitted that they never even watched the original series?

I guess things got a little better when Manny whatever came on board but who the heck was still watching by the point? I never even bothered watching the pilot episode....

Which show sucked more?

 

Beats a captain who got whacked out on anti-psychotics during the closing credits 90% of the episodes, even if it's not as funny.

 

which captain did that?

 

BSG was better than most of Trek anyways. Adama would have gotten Voyager home and whatever the NX-01 did done in less than one episode. All with one good speech and a glare, then he'd beat the Borg Queen to death with a flashlight.

 

That would be Janeway. She had more personalities than Sybil, was more manic depressive than an alcoholic coke addict, and had more murderous impulses than the 9/11 hijackers all put together.

 

Janeway kept Harry an Ensign for 7 years for shits and giggles. I'm surprised he didn't jump in front of any phaser fired in his general direction.

 

She needed way more holodeck fucking.
Mark, Chakotay, Seven, Davinci, Seven, dogs, whatever it took.

 

[yt=On the holodeck babyy!!]GP0DE3tqqBs[/yt]

 

Kazon gangbang?

 

Bukkakke.

 

On the holodeck, baby, you can do anything you want!

 

Well he did jump out of a hull breach one time. But Janeway just plucked him out of another universe.
Proving he couldn't escape Voyager even in death.

 

Link to the interview is on post 97 of this thread.

 

Harry's life must have been hell. He was an Ensign for nearly a decade while Kirk went from Cadet to Captain in less than a week. Then his one true love was obvious to his feelings and married a half-Klingon.

 

I've always wondered about that. Obviously, the technology can make the holodeck items real - they sit on chairs and open doors, ride horses and bikes, but ... can they make ... man parts real?

 

I often hear this complaint yet I never hear the reasoning behind the opinion.

 

She was out of character several times, but ..., I wouldn't go so far as to call her Sybil - or even Eve.

 

I guarantee you that you regularly hear the reasoning, but don't listen. Sheesh.

Janeway was definitely a personality-of-the-week, a guest star playing a different role every episode. Hard nosed, retarded, murderous, deathly depressed, total softie, completely psychotic, clever, stoic; you never knew who was going to show up. I'm pretty sure all of them showed up in Endgame, which makes it an appropriate finale. My knowledge of Voyager is hardly encyclopedic, but there's no sensible way to argue that the captain in, for example, various season six episodes (Equinox, The Voyager Conspiracy, Spirit Folk, Good Shepherd, and Unimatrix Zero) was written with anything approaching a degree of consistency. Murderous monomaniacal psychopath, absurdly patient and attentive, complete fucking moron with a sentimental attachment to her dildo that puts her crew's lives in danger, mama hen, even more completely fucking moronic but with a side of god/hero complex and an overdose of dumb luck to save her from herself. More than any of the rest of the crew, Janeway's character was completely different week-to-week in order to force her into a story written without taking account of her character. So different, in fact, that it can't sensibly be called a single character.

If you watched the show at all, you know this, even if you've blacked it out.

 

Now, now, no need to make this personal.

I enjoy hearing your opinion in greater detail yet it doesn't answer my question.

I believe I've seen every episode, maybe more than once and I've yet (even in hyperbolic terms) to come to the same conclusion about Janeway.

 

My ratings of the latter day series:

TNG -

DS9 -

VOY -

ENT -

 

Sisko was the field commander type. And olmos as adama is better performance then stewart as picard.,

 

Space channel in Canada plays Star Trek back to back to back on most weeknights. It starts at 01:00 with Voyager, then at 02:00 with TNG, then at 03:00 they show DS9. I tend to catch Voyager after the late news, and maybe half the time catch TNG if I'm still wide awake. But if I'm home on Friday night, I'll watch all three.

Last night, the DS9 episode they showed was "Once More Unto The Breach". I think it is considered one of the "ok" episodes of DS9, but when you compare it with the absolute crap I've been watching lately with Voyager, the two shows are like night and day.

Something I noticed with DS9 is they really knew how to respect what came before. By this time of the 7th season, Gene Roddenberry was firmly in his casket and couldn't interfere anymore. From what I remember, he didn't really want to have much to do with TOS, so I am guessing he might have had some problems with them bringing on an old character from the original series.

Great episode all around! It dealt with getting old - and class warfare - and all sorts of themes that made it more than the sum of its parts. And we got to see a planetary raid! Favorite moment for myself was seeing those B'rel BOPs fly above DS9 like than and then cloak before heading out!

Fuck you VOY and fuck you ENT. Why couldn't you have been this good?

 

GR didn't like TOS as much after the strict censorship from that era was over. TNG was probably a lot closer to what he wanted to do if you read some of the notes from back when they were discussing Phase II and what would later become TMP. So I can see why he basically told everyone to ignore TOS. It's also why I'm actually not much of a GR fan, despite more or less being a fan of what he created.

 

Yeah. Right bastard that Roddenberry. Ditching TOS like that in favour of TNG and Berman Trek and refusing to have any TOS references in the 24th Century.

 

Yeah, if you read any of the books on the formation of TNG then the repeated theme is that Roddenberry really did want to go as far as possible with his idea of human utopia and the studio had to beat him down somewhat. For instance, it was he wo insistes that men wear skirts and he didn't want the bridge to have a Captain's chair because he thought it to authoritarian and throne like.

 

The reasoning is simple -- BAD WRITING!!! All of the characters suffered from it, but Janeway got the worst of it since she's supposed to be the star and the Captain.

I now hear that Braga is going to be headlining Spielberg's new dino-themed series. I'm amazed this guy could get job running the Slurpee machine at 7-11 after his last several failures.

 

This thread remains me of what Winston Churchill reportedly said after Nazi Germany invaded the Soviet Union.

"Pity they both can't lose".

 

Warning to Chup for flaming in Media Central.