Israel is Coming Apart at the Seams, It Seems

You sure that's Bingo? That looks like Tic-Tac-Toe with the O's not being allowed to play.
Bingo should be a 5x5 grid with a free space in the center!

Good luck with that. The people of Flint will suffer until they can increase the bank account of Nestle’s

Mass graves in Gaza.

Blinken believes that denying water, fuel and food to people is barbaric, when Russia does it.

There is no humanitarian crisis, claims the Israeli ambassador to the UK.

Member of Spanish government seeks to bring war crimes charges.

Doctor in Gaza staying with his patients rather than obey criminal orders to evacuate.

Some more commentary:

• Israel has now killed significantly more children in Gaza in one week that Russia have in Ukraine since the start of the war there.
• Zelenksy has fallen into line with the US-Israeli position (as he knows who is paying for his weapons) but the total exposure of western commitment to the rule of law as a sham explains both why the global South has not supported Ukraine and why it will be very difficult to oppose Russia on the same basis going forward.
• Ursula Von Der Leyen, having attempted to cancel aid to Palestine and project an image of "unity" with Israel, has apparently been told to stay within her mandate and sit the fuck down by EU governments. Her latest statements are now expressing concern for Palestinians and a tripling of aid.
• Those calling for the emergence of a Mandela or Gandhi figure from Palestine and for Palestinians to pursue peaceful methods might want to examine their own attitudes to their doing exactly that - BDS (against which many laws have been enacted) and the March of Return in 2018 (when Israel killed hundreds).
• It is absolutely justified for third parties to intervene to attempt to prevent genocide. Remember that if Hezbollah or Iran kick something off, and there is much wailing and gnashing of teeth. In fact, US reinforcements arriving are aimed at mitigating that, and allowing Israel to act with impunity.
• The only restraint that the US recognises as legitimate for Israel is itself. That's why it seems they pressured for the water to be partially switched back on. They're also making statements against an 'occupation' of Gaza, which perhaps indicates that that's what Israel wants to end up with. (Notwithstanding the fact that it's already technically an occupation.)

Apparently Israel provides around 10% of Gaza's water.

The two reasons the other 90% isn't really potable is down to:

• Israeli blocking of equipment, stopping waste water treatment
• Hamas actively destroying the internal water infrastructure, such that would have UK water companies positively envious.

That bit of information adds a bit of context.

If Hezbollah and Iran attack Israel it sure as shit won't be to "prevent genocide," it'll be to commit a different genocide. And you already know that. Are you going to pretend to be surprised if it happens, or will you fall back on the "they brought this on themselves" line like you did after the initial Hamas attack?

https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-t...mmunities-along-lebanese-border-amid-attacks/

Israel is evacuating all civilians within two kilometers of the Lebanese border.

That's just a flat out lie. I said no such thing after the initial Hamas attack.

I won't be surprised if Hezbollah or Iran get involved, or if they also commit crimes when they do so - and I will think it a very bad idea whatever the case, since they will lack the capability to do anything meaningful and the result will be a larger war. However the point remains - stopping a genocidal state with force is justified and legally they would be in the right to argue so. The IDF forces currently engaged in the slaughter of children in Gaza should be killed rather than being allowed to continue. A logic that you and others have no trouble whatsoever applying to Russians.

Any soldier that intentionally targets civilians or non-combatants should be brought up on charges. Full stop.

Pope Francis' representative in the Holy Land said on Monday he was willing to exchange himself for Israeli children taken hostage by Hamas and held in Gaza.

Cardinal Pierbattista Pizzaballa, the Patriarch of Jerusalem, made his comment in response to a question during a video conference with journalists in Italy.

"I am ready for an exchange, anything, if this can lead to freedom, to bring the children home. No problem. There is total willingness on my part," he said.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...offers-be-exchanged-gaza-hostages-2023-10-16/

You know it's bad over there when the Vatican representative is the most likeable public figure.

Yah, but Israel doesn't tend to do so well with doing that.

Nah, you just posted links to editorials saying that. Huge difference.

How comes Israel gets to be a "genocidal state" that it's right to stop with force but Gaza doesn't?

Do you seriously think the IDF is in Gaza for Operation Child Slaughter, with the slaughter of children as their primary goal? Or do you think maybe they're there to dismantle the Hamas infrastructure that helped them orchestrate their attack?

Which ones? And while you're at it, go back and answer to the other accusation you made about complicity in war crimes.

Gaza is not a state. Gaza is a concentration camp.

I think that they're gunning for revenge and further annexation of land, which may include displacing the people who live there. They have little interest in retrieving hostages as they've apparently killed many of them with their own bombs. And it would require significant brain trauma to maintain that their actions (and many of their words) over the past week are consistent with protecting civilians. As I stated earlier in the thread, the primary goal of Israeli foreign policy is domination, not security.

Okay. But only as long as he isn’t allowed alone with any of them any time during the exchange.

Looks like the 26th MEU and the Bataan Amphibious Ready Group are also heading to the Eastern Med.

We consider the USS Bataan an amphibious assault ship, but other’s might consider her an aircraft carrier:



(She is twice the size of the old British Invincibles for some perspective.)

Oh, probably. But Hamas is apparently using underground tunnels in Gaza. How do you get at them without the people living in the surface getting in the way?

https://embassies.gov.il/MFA/AboutIsrael/Maps/Pages/Israels Disengagement Plan- 2005.aspx#:~:text=By 22 September 2005, Israel's,settlements in Samaria, was completed.

Israel's plan of unilateral disengagement from the Gaza Strip and North Samaria put forward by Prime Minister Ariel Sharon was carried out on 15 August 2005. The purpose of the plan was to improve Israel's security and international status in the absence of peace negotiations with the Palestinians.

With the implementation of the plan, IDF installations and forces were removed and over 9000 Israeli citizens living in 25 settlements were evicted. By 22 September 2005, Israel's withdrawal from the entire Gaza Strip to the 1967 Green Line, and the eviction of the four settlements in Samaria, was completed.

Oh yeah, that's a country that wants to annex as much land as possible.

Those events are complex but either way, it is not 2005 now.

And I note that once again, you are not prepared to substantiate your accusations.

That might be an interesting question, were it addressed honestly. However the record here is that every time Israel conducts operations in Gaza, every independent investigation finds that there was no military utility for a large proportion of their strikes. And this time, they have openly said that they are interested in "damage rather than precision". To say nothing of their shutting off fuel, food and water. Openly targeting hospitals and the rest. It just isn't a sustainable argument to anyone interested in reality that they aren't targeting civilians.

When did the Palestinians elect a government that has the murder of everyone in Israel as part of it's charter again? Oh, right, Jan 2006. Wonder what happened to Israel's point of view after that.

Hell of a gesture. Of course, only that.

And if they actually did make the swap, can you imagine what would happen if something happened to the Pope?

There's more Catholics than there are Protestants, and nearly as many as there are Muslims total.

We really don't need another Crusade.

I believe the Pope’s Legate was only offering he himself as a Cardinal and not offering Pope Francis.

I know I'll be accused of condoning Hamas, but that's a significant distortion. The original charter contained much that is obscene but it never said that, and it was replaced in 2017.

But yes, their "point of view" has changed.

Question, do you genuinely think this shit makes you look intelligent?

No, I don't think it makes Rick look intelligent.

Coulda sworn my post was after FF's. Might have been a page rollover.

Oh, now it was.

And no, he doesn't sound intelligent.

Did anyone see the 60 Minutes interview with Biden? Why is he talking about peace and a two state solution and all of the usual American stance on one hand while The White House takes a cease fire off the table? Does anyone think this sounds like double speak that might come back to bite them later? Even the Nixon administration, of all people, took a neutral stance.

Remember ISIS? They're back! In pog form! And stabbing folks in Brussels.

https://news.sky.com/story/two-peop...ead-in-brussels-belgian-media-report-12985711

No, tell us more. Do you have a link and recommended time stamp?

You tell us. Did you watch the 60 Minutes interview with Biden before you asked us if we did?

Simple question.