Poll: Is it OK to put children in cages?

You’ve been held against your will at amusement parks?[/quote]

It is my understanding that on every ride I've been on that they will not let you leave until the ride ends.

Could be some kind of safety issue.

You got on the ride of your own free will, you weren't forced, and you know when, how, and where you'll be done.

You’ve been held against your will at amusement parks?[/quote]

I have! Just ask any parent. "The Happiest Place On Earth" is the exit of the Disneyland parking lot! Can I get an amen?

I wish these brown people would try to sneak into Japan! They would call their facilities "super happy fun-time tentacle-rape sex robot neon thrill city and Hello Kitty prefecture".

I'll believe it when it happens. You'll forgive me if I don't take this administration at its word.

I am not Alt-Right. Don’t start that shit again just because there are people, like me, on this board who don’t agree with your political leanings.

The meme, an actual cover from Time, is so fucked up that knowing the truth about the little girl makes Trump look good because it makes it easy for him to say, “look at the fake media and their fake stories.”

The left, particularly the media, actually makes it easier for Trump in the upcoming midterms.

There isn’t going to be a blue wave at this point. (Saying there won’t be a blue wave doesn’t mean I think a red wave will happen. Most likely at this point things are a draw. However a draw in the midterms is a loss for the Democrats.)

Not a meme, the actual magazine cover.



I'm no Trump supporter at all, but as a journalist I've got a big problem with that cover. Not only is it inaccurate, but it's too sensational for a publication that purports to be a news magazine.

Makes me think of the Newsweek cover that darkened OJ's mug shot to make it look more sinister.

FTFY

Agreed. I have a problem with it because it not only misrepresents an actual photo, it does so by manipulating that image of a terrified child for political points. I think Trump's a giant asshole, and I think he's an insensitive, self-absorbed, arrogant jackass who has no problem having kids thrown in cages in order to keep the brown people from crossing our imaginary line, but the Time cover completely changes the tone of the image and turns it into a meme that will be more grist for the mill, and nothing good will come of it.

lol now the alt-left grows concerned about the lives of babies

Several hours before your post I saw Times themselves put out a correction that the child stayed with the mother. Poor choice of photo for the cover, but it's bigger than that specific photo and the issue is more that so many people are fine with the policy.

As for the other claims, got a source that there was no violence and she wasn't fleeing her husband?

So true. How could Obama wrap brown kids in aluminum foil for eight years and think that’s okay? At least we finally have a POTUS who’s willing to put an end to this disgusting policy.

Newsweek did a lot worse than that.

when you are physically barred from following established procedure, or when you do so and still lose your kids (both of which happened) then your question becomes moot.

also, U.S. citizens fail to follow "established legal procedures" ALL THE TIME often without suffering any loss and certainly not suffering THIS loss.

Also, the rules that exist are overwhelmingly idiotic bullshit designed to either pump the interest of exploitative employers or pander to the xenophobia of the GOP base. If you set up an irrational and unnecessarily complex and expensive "right" way to do things, you will - shocker - find many are unaware of the requirements and/or unable to afford the process.

After being screened for obvious illegal motive such as smuggling, trafficking, etc (which typically isn't attempted in the broad daylight like this) - YEP.

similar to "sad trombone"

I'll say it. Of course they have to BE actual refugees, that's implicit in his phrasing, but otherwise - sure.

It should be VASTLY easier to come to this country and live here than it is. If we want to protect "American jobs" from being flooded with immigrants (which, as we've discussed elsewhere, the nature of work is going to be revolutionized by automaton in the coming decades anyway, that can be done on the employer side more easily than the immigrant side.

which shit, by the way, is happening as an almost direct result of bad U.S. policies in the region in the '70s and '80s as a result of the "OMG COMMUNISM EVERYWHERE!!!!" nonsense.

Obama detained families in compliance with Flores - short term (20 days or less) and unaccompanied minors were subject to attempts to reunite with family. Nothing in Trump's EO actually oblidges the agencies to do either. It's a dog and pony show as usual.

Also Obama's border/immigration policy sucked and was reactionary to the mythology that you could win support for reform if you demonstrated you were "tough" at the border. That turned out to be bullshit but he did a lot of unwise things in pursuit of it.

Relevant:
https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Forei...ul-family-management-program-amid-budget-cuts

June 9, 2017 Houston—The Trump administration is shutting down the least restrictive alternative to detention available to asylum-seekers who have entered the US illegally, The Associated Press has learned.

Immigration activists consider the move a callous insult to migrants fleeing traumatic violence and poverty – nearly all the program's participants are Central American mothers and children – by a White House that has prioritized deportations that break up families over assimilating refugees.

"This is a clear attempt to punish mothers who are trying to save their children's lives by seeking protection in the United States," said Michelle Brane of the nonprofit Women's Refugee Commission. "I think it's crazy they are shutting down a program that is so incredibly successful."

The overwhelming majority of asylum-seekers that US Immigration and Customs Enforcement spares confinement at family detention centers – about 70,000 – have been placed in an intrusive "intensive supervision" program as they await court hearings on whether they can stay in the US.

GPS ankle monitors are strapped on 3 in 7 people. The wearers, mostly women, complain of bruises and public ostracism.

The Family Case Management Program that is being shuttered had 630 families enrolled as of April 19. Essentially a counseling service, it has operated in Chicago, Miami, New York, Los Angeles, and Baltimore/Washington, D.C., since January 2016. Social workers help participants find lawyers, navigate the overburdened immigration court system, get housing and health care, and enroll the kids in school.

Women who previously would have been eligible can now expect to be put on ankle monitors, said Lilian Alba, program manager at the International Institute of Los Angeles, one of the community-based agencies running the program.

It will end June 20, according to a letter signed by Ann M. Schlarb, an executive with GEO Group Inc., the for-profit Boca Raton, Fla., prison company that operated the program under contract with ICE.

Dated Thursday, the letter was emailed to members of an advisory group and provided to the AP by Ms. Brane, who received it at the end of business hours.

The program's director at GEO Group, Mary Loiselle, referred all questions to ICE, which was reached by email but had no immediate comment.

Ms. Schlarb did not explain in the letter why ICE decided to shutter the program, whose contract had been renewed in September for a year.

"The families have thrived," wrote Schlarb, president of the GEO Group division that also manages the company's electronic-monitoring business. She noted that 99 percent of participants "successfully attended their court appearances and ICE check-ins." That includes more than a dozen families who were ultimately deported, added Brane, a member of a DHS advisory panel on family detention.

A regulated border with sane, easy to access, and non-xenophobic entry/exit regulations would be a massive boon for the economy, less expensive (even if you built a ridiculous wall in the bargain) and allow resources to be directed towards interdicting felony activity that actually is harmful to everyone.

But we'd be less white in the process and about 1/3 of Americans, who make up a majority of the GOP, simply cannot abide THAT.

this was written by a writer who's also a retired Navy Chief named Jim Wright who is a must-follow on social media. Tons of wisdom delivered with style.
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@Stonekettle
Stonekettle Retweeted

This one is going to require some deconstruction.

First, define "Strong Southern Border." What does that mean? He's been talking about this for years, so have conservatives, but what does it mean? No border is 100% impermeable. Even the Berlin Wall wasn't. So...
1/ https://twitter.com/realDonaldTr…/status/1010156224749408258 …

...when Trump says, "Strong Southern Border," what does he mean? How impermeable does he expect his great wall to be? How much will it cost, to build, to maintain, to operate, to patrol, in perpetuity? And how effective does he expect it to be? He NEVER provides answers.

Second, "Overrun?" Are we really being overrun by illegal immigrants? Conservatives keep talking about an "invasion." Trump uses that exact word. But, well, where is it?

These people come here for the same reason drugs do. BECAUSE AMERICANS WANT THEM.
We like cheap labor.
We like cheap products. We like our food picked, processed, and cooked for cheap. We love cheap lawn care and cheap babysitters and cheap maids. And don't tell me we don't. I lived in Southern California, I saw it with my own eyes.

Americans bitch about illegal immigrants, but they're down cruising the corners every morning hiring out cheap day laborers and they sure as hell ain't checking for green cards.

No, we like cheap labor and we love not paying benefits, or taxes, or workman's comp, or a living wage, or healthcare, or any of the other things we'd have to pay actual citizens.
Just like drugs. We complain, we make it illegal, but we keep right on buying them.

The simple truth of the matter is that we LIKE having illegal immigrants around to do the shitty work BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO PAY AN AMERICAN.
If we did, then manufacturing, customer service, tech support, programming, billing and payrolls service, telemarketing...

...pharmacy services, data processors, medical transcription, credit analysis, insurance underwriting, drafters and illustrators, switchboard operators, bookkeeper, and all the other jobs we increasingly send overseas, would still be right here in America.

Hell, TRUMP HIMSELF just hired 70 foreign workers for his "Southern White House."

The Trump Organization routinely hires foreign workers because they're cheaper than Americans. He say he can't get Americans, but that's because he won't pay them a living wage.

No wall, no border -- no matter how secure -- will change that. Just as it won't keep Americans from buying drugs manufactured in Central America.
If there's a demand, migrants, legal and illegal, will find a way.

And Trump knows it.

Trump knows it, or at least his advisers do. Look at the emphasis of his comments: Crime. Terrorism. Invasion. But he NEVER mentions why these people come here in the first place. He tries to scare you with some MS-13 bogyman. But he doesn't talk about CAUSE.

Third, sadness and grief.
Imagine what it must take to send your child north through Central America to brave our southern border. Alone.
No matter how bad we make it, no matter the consequences, it's STILL better HERE than THERE.

Just as it was for the despised Jews who fled Hitler's Germany in the 1930s.

We send these migrant children back to horror and death and slavery. Just as we turned back those Jews at the Statue of Liberty, sent home to horror and death, to our everlasting shame.

Grief? Sadness? Imagine the grief of having your child taken from you, not knowing where she is, what happened to him, if you'll ever see them again.

Trump dismisses their grief just as American plantation owners once dismissed the suffering of enslaved blacks, the grief of having their children taken away and sold off to other slavers, by saying, "they can't feel love for their children the same way we do."

The only thing phony here are the crocodile tears shed by the fake Christians, conservatives all, who cry for the little children whenever they want to force their horrible religion on the rest of us or when THEY want to win votes from their pinch-faced base.

And finally, there's the last bit.

There are no pictures of children TAKEN FROM THEIR PARENTS at the border under Obama because it never happened. This is a TRUMP policy. In fact, Trump bragged about it: we are finally enforcing the law, he said, something Obama didn't.

Trump's own words make a lie of Trump's own words.

But the lie is much, much bigger.
Obama, democrats, they DID try to fix this. They DID try to make a home for these children. From the DREAM Act to a dozen other attempts, ALL of which were blocked by the GOP.

And nothing shows what a child Trump is like that petulant final line, "Obama [...] had the same pictures, and did nothing about it!"

I can hear my mother's voice, "If Obama jumped off a cliff, would you do so too?"

It didn't happen under Obama and "others," but if did it would have been just as wrong and I would have called it out just as loudly. Attempting to justify his horrible actions by passing the buck is classic Trump. He's never taken responsibility for anything in his life.

No matter what anyone did or did not do prior to this administration, TRUMP owns it now. If he takes credit for the economy, recovered under Obama, then he must likewise take credit for this AND the nascent fascism evident in nearly every aspect of his White House.

And it's likewise long past time for America to face up to the fact that immigrants come here because WE can't live the life we've become accustomed to without them.

brown kids in aluminum foil? I just have to get that recipe! I never knew the right way to grill them!

Don't forget to slather 'em in this!




And serve these on the side!