Rich, Black, and Flunking..

Rich, Black Students Don't Want to be Succesful

Last sentence: so it becomes a circle again?

Blame WHITEY for the Black populace not doing well?



More pages of the article: 2, 3, 4, 5

Interesting read, to say the least.

In the later portions of the article it is stated that some rival anthropologists and researchers claim that the pressure to 'act White', in the sense, to speak normal spoken English is what distanced the Black children from their studies.

From page 4

So in essence, just speaking or communicating in NORMAL/REGULAR English, is being like Whitey?



I wonder though how the African American members of WF - Alphaman, Anna Yolei, Herbalist, Lt. Mewa, Raoul and Vandy - react to this article? Is it true, I mean, being AA, that you guys had to face the same form of mentality from your school peers, friends and community if you tried to speak 'regular' English? Or is the research just completely stupid?



Even later, it is said that the researcher, Mr. Ogbu, has an "avalanche of criticism" towards him for the study he had done. Just because he pointed out the problems that are plaguing the Black communit(y/ies) directly, he is the recepient of harsh criticism.

Now it seems though the problem is with African-Americans only (saying Blacks would encompass all). African immigrants seem to do pretty well if they get the opportunity to do well, so why can't naturally born American Blacks? Is it the .. ahem.. 'liberal' mentality of "The world owes ME for my existence" attitude that has diluted the African-American populace? Or is it easier to be a baggy pants lowering, turned-hat wearing thug than a respectable doctor, engineer or scientist?



In conclusion, it can be said, at least by what it seems in the article, that the AA community want to blame everyone else for their woes, but won't try to take criticism for their own faults or shortcomings, even if they are self-imposed.

And if told what can be done to make it better, they just shun it.

Discuss.

:IMHO!:

GOod article.

Raoul is black?

Geez, first I find out Ramen's a chink, now this.

What's next, Storm's an indian?

Ramen's a chick?

I hate the term African American.

Black, ok. Just black.

Yep, gigantor is a clit.

I... think so.

What?

No African-Blackyard?

I miss negro.
It had power.
Sounds like a viking battle call or something.

*Pulls back fist*
Neeeeeeee *throws punch, and fires an energy blast* GRO!!!!!!!!!

It's absurd to draw broad generalizations from the limited experience of a relatively few black families in Shaker Heights.

Let me emphasize the following from the above-excerpted article:

It is far more important to realize that minorities have always been oppressed in America and are still oppressed today, albeit somewhat less so. This is the real reason that they almost invariably suffer academically, economically, and socially. Even more alarmingly, minorities suffer from greater physical ailments as a result of stress and other issues unique to nonwhites in this country.

How close are you to Bangor? I'm going to give you a mushroom tattoo on your forehead.

Summing up that entire multi-thousand-word article into simpler terms: Blacks in America flunk out because they are infested with the "Yo white ass OWE me!" mentality.

[YT=!!!]yuiA2j52rP8[/YT]

Ramen's a chick?

Holy crap. I thought Ramen was a dude with that kind of screwy humor.

But, as for the original posts goes, those blacks shouldn't be in a University if they don't want to succeed. There are people who do want to succeed who deserve to be there more than those people.

I disagree. The article very thoroughly presents the dilemmas of societal alienation facing minorities today and explains why they are often made to fail in academic and other settings. The hostility they face from an increasingly callous society makes further progress almost impossible.

Yeah, when in doubt, blame whitey. At all times blame whitey. If you're white and not already guilty then jump on the bandwagon and hate yourself now!

It's not just whitey. Notice that I did not specify that it was "white society" that hated minorities. Some minorities hate other minorities. Blacks and Latinos often hate each other. It's tragic, but true.

The bottom line is that African-Americans often have the worst of it. Their political power is being diluted by Hispanics and they are often cast as the "worst performing" of all minorities. That kind of approach does nothing more than pour salt in the wound and worsen the class and racial conflicts we already see around us.

The academic researcher cited in the article is obviously being exploited by those who already have a dim view of minorities and are willing to ignore their many legitimate complaints. Whatever the reasons behind their attitudes, the end result is horrific from the standpoint of societal development and social justice.

But Whitey gets the blame because it's the in thing to do.

Usually conservative whitey.

And yet liberal whitey takes all the guilt onto himself.

Humans are funny animals.
Always doing crazy tricks.

Well, okay. So? Whites are also the most powerful group in American society. It's like how America as a whole is instinctively blamed whenever the world sees something wrong. America's sheer influence makes that knee-jerk inescapable -- and often rightfully so. Same with whites in society.

I have this dream that someday people will accept responsibility for themselves, and their own successes and failures will be placed on their own heads by them, and they will quit looking for blame, and quit wallowing in self-pity, and quit wanting to be victimized.

It's kind of hard to succeed when so many people around you are so determined to put you down. Have you looked at all the negative comments about African-Americans in this thread alone? Does this not suggest something to you about how difficult it must be even to get to where they are today?

Strip humanity of its will.
That'll fix it.

I don't agree.

Here's why.

Because when it looks as though a black man is doing good and gets along with whitey, he'll be branded as an Uncle Tom traitor to the black community.

It happened to Bill Cosby over his show "The Cosby Show" and his criticisms of the racism in the black community. It happened to Condi Rice and Colin Powell because "they're not giving back to the black community" and even Obama has been criticised as being to light-skinned for blacks to identify with him to get their vote.

The conformity inherent to the very notion of "black community", is the problem.

Bullshit. Neither white society nor black society, if such things even exist, are actively plotting to restrict anyone from education. Whatever things my ancestors did is not keeping Jamal or Shaniqua from learning Calculus and becoming an engineer.

I'm white. You know what I want? I want black people to succeed. I want them to be able to compete with everyone else in America. I want to see blacks in science, and medicine, and law, and engineering. I don't want to see black scientists, black doctors, black lawyers, and black engineers. I want to see scientists, doctors, lawyers, and engineers who just happen to be black.

I want to see black people move on from the past. Slaves got a raw deal. That was 142 years ago. Jim Crow was shitty. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was 43 years ago. How much time is enough before the black community stops crying about what was and starts playing the hand it is dealt? How long before the black community makes the necessary social changes in their own communities that make success obtainable?

If you want to see who is holding blacks back, quit looking towards Whitey and start looking towards blacks claiming education is selling out to the man.

Without reading the author's actual research, I don't fully know what to make of it.

My sense from reading the article is that this researcher, as researchers tend to do, saw evidence that fit a theory and excluded evidence that didn't fit.

I would be interested in whether he examined the differences (if any) between the black students who did well, the black students who were flunking, the white students who did well and the white students who were flunking.

I'd also be interested in how many of the homes he studied were those of student-athletes.

Personally, I think that our culture across the board makes studying seem uncool and nerdy, regardless of color. Let me know when the math team captain has the same shot with the hottest girl in school as some random scrub on the football team.

Certainly, some of the fault for black students who aren't doing well lies with their own attitudes and that of their parents. And ultimately, whatever obstacles they face, they probably should work harder to overcome them.

What's surprising to me is his finding that the well-to-do black parents were not involved with their kids' educations.

In terms of how that compares to my own personal experience, I lived in a black middle-class neighborhood but went to a predominately white upper-class private school. I didn't really socialize all that much with my neighbors beyond the occasional video game or round of basketball (at which I sucked).

Though there were a handful of black students at my school, I didn't go out of my way to socialize with them or vice versa.

I would say the black students at my school fit roughly the same overall range as the high school. There were some people who were high academic achievers, and some middle, some low.

Growing up, I never heard anyone call me or anyone else out for "acting white" in the sense of studying or speaking properly. If I had, it wouldn't have mattered very much.

My parents instilled in me very early a realization of the importance of education, and I actually enjoyed studying.

That's a legitimate issue and it's a bit difficult to resolve. However, rather than laying blame on minorities, why not eliminate the cause of their self-hatred by making it by its inherent nature impossible to deride anyone for "acting white"? Once whites cease giving minorities a reason to resent many of the things associated with them by supporting the cause of minorities and their culture, the internal strife endemic to many minority subcultures will diminish.

I contend, furthermore, that is insulting in the extreme to pretend that the fear of "acting white" is a permanent feature impeding the progress of minorities. We only need to remember that African-American attitudes as they were during the Harlem Renaissance proved as conducive as any other in promoting individual success, in addition to contributing mightily to the rich tapestry of American culture. This attitude was hardly one that resented success as "too white," any more than is the attitude of most successful blacks today.

I think you are inflating all these arguments.

I don't remember anyone in the black community branding Bill Cosby as a traitor or an Uncle Tom.

In terms of Condi and Collin, the only ones I remeber seeing refer to them as Uncle Tom-ish is Harry Belafonte, and he's a few bananas short of a full tally these days. It certainly wasn't over "not giving back to the black community."

And as for Obama, the only people I've seen wondering about whether he's too light-skinned or whatever have been white pundits. There might be a conservative black pundit or two out there, but I think it's largely something that's made up.