What is immoral about sex before marriage?

Because if God is watching me hold my pecker, without my express permission, then God is a pervert.

That is ridiculous and stupid beyond belief.

Yeah, think of God not as a peeper, but as a doctor...or a jaded and bored Vivid Productions cameraman.

Because it's none of his business...

You realize that you just asked me why I didn't think an all powerful, all knowing, universe spanning Supreme Being would care about what I do with my penis, right?

But at least he's clarified why he thinks sex is so icky. I mean, could you relax with God the Peeping Tom watching over your shoulder?

Relax?

That's a turn-on, baby.

Strictly speaking El Chups OP is why is premarital sex immoral. Not why it is a bad idea regardless of moral beliefs (and I've listed why I think it is in another thread some months ago).

As far as morals, I get my morals from the New Testament of the Bible. It specifies fornication (premarital sex) as a sin and thus to me it is a sin and immoral.

wikipedia entry as good as any of these purposes.

Extramarital sex is considered to be immoral by most Christian groups, who base this primarily on passages like 1 Corinthians 6:9-10:

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor those who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.
It is listed as a sin here and in other passages (along with idolatry, theft, greed, lying, and sexual perversion). While the next verse from the above passage is quick to point out that although some Christians used to practice those sins—that they have since been "justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ" and are thus forgiven their sins—extramarital sex has historically been considered to be one of the more serious and damaging sins, possibly because of passages like 1 Corinthians 6:18 that speak of it as sinning against one's own body.

Do you ever question what the bible says?

Of course.

Sure, all that "love your neighbor as yourself" stuff is just soooo inconvenient.

Not to mention "Sell all you have and give to the poor" and "Judge not that ye be not judged."

And bacon. Especially bacon.

That isn't in the New Testament anyway garamet.

So then why are so many Christers so upset about gays being able to marry now?

It is condemned in Corinthians (see above) which certainly is in the New Testament.

Oh I'm sure lots of Christians love to go back and quote Leviticus or somewhere in the OT, but their use of the OT is mistaken.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10:

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor those who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.

What did Jesus have to say on the subject?

He never mentioned homosexuality.

But the New Testament is not just the words of Jesus.

Those can be a pain in the ass. Unless they're pussies, and then you just tell "If you gave her what she needs and wants, she wouldn't need me."

So where does the NT say "homosexuality is evil" and why are the words of some Saul-come-lately more important than the words of the Master?

1 Corinthians 6:9-10:

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor those who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.

The entire early Christian church including the leaders of the apostles who had walked with Jesus accepted Saul (Paul) and validated his ministry.

I'm not going to second guess Peter (leader of the apostles), John (the beloved apostle) and the rest regarding Saul(Paul).

What did Jesus say on the subject?

Oh, and regarding things like bacon:

"For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." - Matthew 5:18, and that was said by Jesus.

Correct. Everything "was accomplished" when Jesus was resurrected.

Yeah, that's kinda the point. Mormons do not really believe that sex and marriage are all about the power of creation and procreation. No one really believes that. No religion that I know of bans infertile couples from marrying, automatically annuls infertile marriages, or even bans married infertile couples from having sex. Neither does any religion specifically exempt infertile couples from prohibitions on premarital sex. Religious restrictions on sex and marriage simply are not governed by the belief that all sex should be procreative, all procreation should be within the confines of marriage, or any similar belief or set of beliefs rooted in the supposedly sacred nature of procreation. Beliefs have consequences, and you can claim to hold a belief all you want, but if you don't adhere to the necessarily consequent beliefs of your claimed belief then you don't adhere to the belief you claim.

The fact is that religious rules limiting sex to the confines of marriage make sense only when you realize that they originate out of the belief that women and children are the property of husbands and fathers, and regardless of how the rules have evolved over time they can't be explained by the belief that procreation is sacred and godly.

There's simply no logical connection at all between "sex is playing with the power of creation, ie procreation, something godly" and "only to be invoked by a couple married in the eyes of the law."

That is ridiculous in the extreme and there is no evidence to support that idea.

You are just trying to equate "sexual liberty" with supposedly "liberation of women" because you cannot (nor can anyone) justify premarital sex on any concrete basis.

You can't get past the fact that premarital sex has absolutely no specific benefit for individuals or society.

Oh, it has...immediate...benefit for individuals.

Well for one, you get to see boobs.

And this....



Enough said. So STFU.

Do you have any idea how long I've waited to use that video????

Bullshit. It's fun, reduces stress, fosters intimacy, and so forth and so on.

Bullshit. It's fun, reduces stress, fosters intimacy, and so forth and so on.

No. Mormons believe that a man and woman sealed in the Temple are married for time and all eternity. If one or both are infertile, no problem, they'll have all of the next life to populate their world once they've ascended to godhood.

But go ahead, tell me what Mormons believe.

You know what the rump-rangers and the rug-munchers need? Their own God that can lay down the rules for their LPM's.

LPMs? WTF?