We're all on the same page about Paladin, right?

However you might dress it up, saying that there is a possibility that blacks' genetic makeup may give them a predisposition for failure is racist, ignorant or a troll. Exactly which, or which combination of the three, is an exercise best left to the reader.

thanks, but you're still not really addressing the "biology" factor claim outside of the cultural results-that is, blacks in the US being predisposed to "underperforming" for any reason other than the cultural construct that is America and it's traditional subcultural biases as a whole. Like, are lower academic test scores a result of these such as racially based socio economic barriers, or are you saying they're just not built to be as capable?

There definitely seems to be a real case of racists are bad, I don't think I'm bad, therefore I can't be racist going on here.

Christ, when even Federal Farmer has said your words are the very definition of racism it's time to do some self reflection.

Reminds me of some former TBBS/TNZ members...
And some former WF members...
The whole playing coy thing...

Yet again, this is a guy who chooses as an avatar a character that pretends to be a good guy but is overtly evil and laughs at everyone that buys his act.

Saying that there are biological differences that cause bad outcomes is the epitome of racism, and Paladin knows this. He's hoping to convince others that it isn't true.

There is one final statement to conclude this. There are a number of people around here who defend him and people like him as being normal based on the excuses the racists give.

It is really not that @Paladin is racist if you ask me. It is that he has friends who think they are not complicit when they excuse and defend him.

^Classic association fallacy.

It's not that simple.

Yes, it is that simple, but hello there and thank you for jumping right in front of that. Being complicit is not a fallacy. It is actually one of the strongest ways bigots are able to work their magic. This is why just a few really bad bigots can have such a huge effect. It is complicit people.

I am assuming you are a straight white cis male given how you do not understand how complicit people support bigotry?

Your emotinal rant doesn't change the facts.

I'm not a "friend" of Paladin or anything along those lines. He probably doesn't even recognise my nickname. I probably disagree with him 90 percent of the time. But the idea of "guilt by association" tends to stifle any discussion. And any possibility of entering into dialogue and finding any solutions to social problems. Which in the end simply has to be the goal. It HAS TO. Because there is no alternative. On social media, you can "win" discussions, troll people and beat them up, even humiliate them... With a little skill, it's no problem and no great achievement.

But in the end, we all have to get along somehow in real life. There is simply no alternative.

Of course, that's not the case if social media is just a silly game. To the delight of some net dwellers. But some people here have told me that social media is a part of reality that should be taken seriously by now.

honestly when it comes to racists-and specifically organized ones-there's no need to get along in real life.
They are the bad fruit that rots the rest of a barrel.

I think the take away here isn't the baseball bat, but that last bit about no matter how nicely they come across, these are still shitty people who will cause harm

I despise racists, and I hope you buy that.

But there are things that leave me perplexed. You mentioned the advantages and disadvantages of a relationship between people of different races, and that this should be discussed... Does it make me a racist if I don't give a shit about such things and I don't even dream of worrying about such stuff? I just couldn't care less what colour someone's skin is. I don't take it into account. I only see the human being. And I don't intend to change this.

I've never found a reason to think of you as racist, no...

But then there's that whole thing about being silent against oppression making one an accomplice to it. If we don't call racist actions out or even consider them as existing, we're giving consent. It's easy not to see it or pay any mind if it hasn't harmed us, but the simple fact is that racism (individual and institutional) does harm those it's directed against. You may not want to care, but is it a big deal to be aware and acknowledge the damage caused?

The usual suspect will shit a brick.

I'm willing to cut JJ some slack for being Swiss. I don't know much about the place, but I'm fairly certain it doesn't have a thriving hip hop scene (it also doesn't have huge income disparity or a history of segregation/ghettoizing minorities as far as I know).

The effects of institutional racism just aren't as influential a factor in his world and his experience is likely (mostly) limited to professional relationships... what Shiro would look at as "respectability".

I'm okay with that.

1. I didn't comment on Jan Jansen.
2. I guess I have to delete my sub-par skits faster.

There is racism here, but the cultural background is completely different. "Race" has perhaps less meaning here because we don't have a history of slavery. But that's not why I like to break out of my culture and adopt your narrative that everything has to be looked at from a racial trait perspective. I just think that in that respect we are lucky to be a little bit further ahead.

further ahead in what regard?

not sure what you mean by break out of your culture, let along to adopt my "narrative" (goddamn, I find that word dismissive)?

"Race" is simply not that important in this country and not at the centre of the discourse. Because there is no nasty history. If I had a black girlfriend, there would probably be a few wry looks from a few hillbillies. But that would be it. Fuck them.

The whole thing is just a lot less charged. There's less discussion. It's absolutely okay to be "colour-blind". From a distance, that's an impossibility with you guys.

That was not really emotional, but your attempt to dismiss it as emotional as to avoid the reality of being complicit in racism is noted.

I will note that most people who are complicit in racism actually detest the racists. That does not mean they do not allow them to act and even support them by being silent for them and never backing the victims. There is a good reason for this in that the racist is the violent attacker and the victims are often not actually attacking anyone. It is much harder to fight the racist bully than to let the victim be victimized. It is called conflict avoidance, and it is why you are so angry right now. You expected everyone to just be quiet while you defended the racists being racist because you are being amiable with the bully. You are complicit so you are not actually attacking anyone on behalf of the racist so why would anyone call you out on your bad behavior. You are not attacking black people, you are just defending Paladin. Of course it is Paladin who is trying to suggest black people are inferior because they are black, but that might be because of genetics, or because of them being black.

Paladin is a racist POS, and if you want to associate with him that is you. However, there are consequences for your actions, and being complicit with racism is going to turn some others off. Don't worry, you did not want to be friendly with me anyway. Anyone who was going to be complicit in racism had best not let their guard down with me. I have known and loved too many black people to want your complicit nature harming them. You are not going to ever step up, and by being complicit you will let the racists strike black people, and me. The raciosts punch me and black people through you, so you can just be with them.

What discussion? Were we going to have a discussion on what levels of racism are acceptable and cool? How about none. If you have any other answer there are 6 billion people in the world I have yet to meet so thanks for putting yourself immediately in the human trash pile. It is so nice when complicit garbage just jumps up and identifies itself. You have saved me lots of time. I know because I have wasted so much time on racist white trash and their complicit allies. It never works out, and I have learned I am just fine with putting you on the trash pile. You might so something like impress me and be a better person than I know you are, but we all know you are not going to do that. Honestly, OMG how awesome would it be to know that is not as pile of shit I am arguing with. It is not like I really want to be right and my environment is better because I am. You are just another pile of complicit shit trying to pretend you are not letting the racists do their things and even helping them by hiding them while they stealthily attack their victims and those who ally with them.

How are you going to solve the social problem of racism by being complicit and hanging out with racists? No really, tell me how that master plan works because if racism is a problem you seem to be defending racists and their actions. Paladin is a fucking racist.

Here is the problem. I would rather get along with black people than Paladin. Paladin wants to be, and is, racist. That is his choice. My choice would be for him to not be a racist and we could all get along, but that is not what I get. So I have to make a choice. I like and love black people. I do not want them discriminated against because it hurts them. Paladin openly supports people who discriminate against them and threaten their happiness and lives. You are complicit and seem to be perfectly willing to never confront those who harm black people because you do not want to anger the racists.

I am holy shit happy to shit on you and the racists you tolerate. Thank you for letting me know who you are. I am not here to get along with racists and their supporters. It is good for you that you are, but you might want to go to another room if you do not want to take heat for it.

You are going to have to define social media here as the general term seems to include many different methods, apps, and designs.

This is social media for some. You might be talking about twitter which is something some of us do not bother with. I do not know what you are actually referring to here.

*Tererun un-hinges her head*
BLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.
(Tornado of "blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah......." forms)

Me- Whoooooaaa!!! Fuckin whoooaaa!!! Fuckin' Whooooaaahhh!!!!

Cow- Moooo!!! Fuckin moooooo!!!!!

Complicit people are the white moderates MLK warned about. I would rather get along with the black people and that means not bringing toxic elements into their lives. Racists love their toxicity and symbols of toxicity to blacks.

Oh, and @Spaceturkey 's example should be heeded on message boards because places like stormfront actively look to infiltrate and occupy message boards and chats.

Was the cow in the tornado, or just watching it?

Tornado cow is always in the tornado

Thoughts and prayers for tornado cow.

We did the play nice thing with Storm.

Turns out that the guy who acted like a racist fuck was actually a dangerous racist fuck.

Paladin said racist shit, and when called out and given an opportunity to explain how we'd misunderstood and he isn't actually racist he doubled down on defining exactly how racist he is.

Fuck being dignified to racists, it's on them for demonstrating that they are biologically or culturally unsuited to the behaviours that lead to successfully being part of a community.